I want to make a cold smoke adapter.
What cords do I need to plug in to get it to work?
Thanks
Jim O
No cords are needed. You are simply moving the puck burner out of the cabinet. You can use some flexible aluminum dryer vent hose and just a cardboard box. Others have used a mailbox.
Here is a pic of mine. I used a cat B vent y-pipe. The spent pucks drop down into the water bowl below from the down tube. Smoke goes up the pipe and does not come back out the down tube because of the heat rising up the tube from the puck burner. The copper heatsinks and fan help remove the excessive heat when I am cold smoking. Simple but effective ;D
(http://i752.photobucket.com/albums/xx169/muebe/IMAG0460.jpg)
Very innovative Muebe. Nice work. Very cool setup, pun intended. ;D
I'm still waiting for him to fabricate the next generation model (think refrigeration coils and a "dial-a-puck" feeder coming from the bisquette storage area, all controlled from a smartphone). Then he can work on the direct feed from the butcher and cheesemonger and the "box to vac pac to fridge/freezer" automation.
It depends on what model you have. If you have one of the digital you need to get an extra long sensor wire that will reach from the back of the cabinet to the location of your generator.
When you order the cold smoke adapter from Bradley, they don't include a longer cord, instead they include a sensor bypass.
Pensrock posted instructions on how to make a bypass (read the entire thread, there may be more information):
Cold Smoker Bypass (http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=9164.msg97088#msg97088)
Quote from: Ka Honu on July 11, 2011, 01:05:13 PM
I'm still waiting for him to fabricate the next generation model (think refrigeration coils and a "dial-a-puck" feeder coming from the bisquette storage area, all controlled from a smartphone). Then he can work on the direct feed from the butcher and cheesemonger and the "box to vac pac to fridge/freezer" automation.
:D :D :D ;D
A fridge/Bradley combo! Great idea Turtle ;)
Thanks for the help guys !
Jim O
Quote from: muebe on July 11, 2011, 10:18:22 AM
No cords are needed. You are simply moving the puck burner out of the cabinet. You can use some flexible aluminum dryer vent hose and just a cardboard box. Others have used a mailbox.
Here is a pic of mine. I used a cat B vent y-pipe. The spent pucks drop down into the water bowl below from the down tube. Smoke goes up the pipe and does not come back out the down tube because of the heat rising up the tube from the puck burner. The copper heatsinks and fan help remove the excessive heat when I am cold smoking. Simple but effective ;D
(http://i752.photobucket.com/albums/xx169/muebe/IMAG0460.jpg)
Very inovative and neatly done. Nice job Muebe.
hey.... yeah. likewise.
very clever and inovative.
how long is your pipe?
i realize... that's too personal.
see, i don't have a garage or basement to set up in, so i'm trying to make a cold-smoke adapter that i can just assemble/disassemble as needed. your y-tube is genious, as is the heat-sink and fan.... but i'm torn between doing what you've done, or just using a longer pipe... easier than yours, but perhaps harder to store. and would it just produce staler smoke? and less strong smoke i imagine, as everything gets coated with smoke-film, therefore longer pipe = less smoke flavour... ok, so i guess i'm lazy.
what percentage of cooling do you think your innovations have produced:
the y-tube and pipe visable in the picture is enough to provide a lot of cooling alone...
but how much more piping is there?
and did you take measurements before adding the copper sinks or fan?
...i want to do the minimum to the maximum effect.
i said i was lazy, but damn i like cheese.
I like that y pipe idea! Been running some ideas for a new setup. I already have a chimney going out of the garage. I want to move the smoke generator a way for cold smoking also. Just so many ways I havn't locked down on one yet.
Here is another picture I had from further back so you can see where the pipe comes through the shelf and attaches to flexible piping that goes into the Bradley cabinet. The blue box that is attached to the pipe left of the heatsink is a thermostat. I can have the fan come on and off as the pipe gets hot. This way it is cooled but not over-cooled. I get a great burn on the puck and almost no heat into the cabinet ;)
(http://i752.photobucket.com/albums/xx169/muebe/IMAG0504.jpg)
Here is cool set up which you can set up and take down in minutes mrhilips
http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=16207.msg194162#msg194162
yeah, i sorta made one of those with by BPS...
the BPS burns much hotter than the OBS as you need both burners on and they are open flame. it ended up singing the aluminum flexitube i had installed.
also, my tin snipping is poor, and there was smoke leakage.
but now i have the OBS and want to make one - i want to use metallic tape to seal, but i don't know if the burner gets too hot for that. i also wasn't sure the silicone would be flavourless and last with all that heat - casue i can taste all the aluminum when it gets hot enough (again, BPS burner hotter).
i like the mailbox, but i also like this last design due to the lack of seals...
muebe, what temp range does your blue box regulate around...
how hot do you let it get before it comes on?
(i've gone with your y-pipe method, but i'm wondewring what to expect WITHOUT the heatsinks and fan...)
oooh! also, this is all 4", right?
the 4" y-pipe barely slides over the end of the burner-plate, snugly scraping the inside actually...
i wasn't sure if that was ok or not or if i've gone with the wrong size tubing - i thought the tight fit might heat-sink the plate too much, resulting in under-burned bisquettes?
Quote from: mrphilips on October 13, 2011, 05:26:17 PM
muebe, what temp range does your blue box regulate around...
how hot do you let it get before it comes on?
(i've gone with your y-pipe method, but i'm wondewring what to expect WITHOUT the heatsinks and fan...)
The box is a attic fan switch. It has a temp range of 60F to 120F. I only turn it on when I am cold smoking. I usually set it to 80F-90F if I am using it. That way I do not cool the pipe down too much and lessen the puck burn.
The heat-sink is simply copper pipe straps for holding pipe to a wall. (http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/611918/611918067711sm.jpg)
I just screwed them directly to the pipe and they wisk away the excess heat. I picked up a bag of 30 clamps for less than $6
I would say to at least install the heat-sinks.
And yes it is 4 inch piping..
thank you sir!
I did the mail box cold smokebox... works like a charm... it actually has a strong smoke smell which is wonderful
No pics....well you know.
I just saw a pair of unicorns feeding in my back yard ;) :D I forgot to take a pic :D
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'm going to get a permanent Set up in corner of garage. Want to cold smoke also. Was thinking of this or the mail box. Problem is I like the Bradley way after re-looking at it. The pipe mounts to cabinet like the smoker. This allows you to remove cold smoking house ant just throw the smoke generator back on. Since we all know they get some heat from the smoke Generator I don't know if it would be harder hot smoking in winter. If I make one I like to have the lugs to mount smoker on and a plate to mount on lugs for pipe. Can't seem to find a metal box I like to make one. Might just make my own box. Any ideas along that line?
if you install the second element (or the 900 watt element) that others have, then you don't have to worry about the extra heat from the generator. You could then have a permanent set up. The less you have to move stuff around the better.
Well I bought an extra element and haven't used it. So that may be a better idea. Will look into that to. Thanks!
muebe... i tried your design.
i excluded the heat sinks for the moment, but will add them if it seems necessary after some heat tests.
problem right away: my smoke is really backing up into the generator!
there seems to be almost 30% loss from there... am i missing something from your design?
see these pics:
(http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd408/mrphilips/IMG00356-20111023-1447.jpg)
(http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd408/mrphilips/IMG00355-20111023-1447.jpg)
any suggestions? does this happen when you run yours?
Do you have your vent open?
actually on further thought, i'm going to say i'm losing at least 50% of the smoke... it's just not being pulled up into to the chamber.
the vent is half-open on the chamber.
so far the temp has got to 87 max in there and it's 60 out... so the smoke has upped the oven less than 30 degress... that'll be a problem in the summer when it's 80 out, so maybe i will need a heat sink on top by then, but right now this is acceptible.
you don't want the smoke backing up into the generator as sooner or later it will get "gummy" in there. Try with your vent wide open.
subtle difference wit the vent full-open.
not much though.
temp dropped a bit too, which is good - but this is a waste of smoke and as GR just pointed out, not good for the generator.
i don't get it... muebe suggested the smoke draws it'self up due to being heated, but this is definitely not working in my setup... scratching my head trying to figure out what i've done differently.
The problem you have is that your generator is level. If your look at my picture you will see that I have mine lifted on the generator pipe side slightly so the smoke can rise and draw. The smoke is going to travel the path of least resistance. With yours level the easiest path is back out the generator. So prop up the end with some blocks and that will solve your problem. It does not need to be a really high angle...just not level ;)
And also when the air is cold in the pipe you can get some smoke coming back out...but no where near what I am seeing in your pictures. Once the air warms up in the pipe there will be less resistance from the cold air forcing down. The natural rise from the heat will create a drafting effect. And try to make the rise of the pipe as straight up as possible for a better draw.
ok... like a chimney.
i will give it another test.
is there any sort of seal or anything on the smokey-end of you pipe or is all based on the draw?
thing is i'm doing this in a slight breeze, i wonder if the moving air is reducing the natural draw.
I do not have a seal and just buts up against the generator housing... but keep in mind that mine is also located in a cabinet and is not affected by the wind. You might have air traveling up the drop tube causing the smoke to back out. I think you just do not have enough of a angle and if you raise the end it should fix the problem.
let's see if this helps...
(http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd408/mrphilips/IMG00361-20111023-1542.jpg)
the ceramic tray from the bottom of a flower pot is propping the unit up about 0.5"
the chunk of 2x4 is just there to help keep the pipe angled.
will confirm in an hour or so...
That should do it...
thanks dude! excited to see the results.
on a related topic, i wish the transparent aluminum scotty uses in that star trek movie about the whales was available... i want to see in that pipe!
i think i was getting a fire-in-the-hole scenario... flaming pukes and a creep-back of char. when i finally disconnected everything, my pucks were showing signs of it.
we will see how the re-adjust affects this as well.
The problem you are having is that your pipe should go straight up from the burning puck. If you look at the bradley cold smoke box and even the cold smoke cardboard box I and others have, the pipe is right in line with the puck burner. That is how the heat of the burner creates the draw up the pipe. The hot air rises, it does not want to travel sideways. Tipping may help but you should put a 90degree turn in it as close to the burner as possible.
...what you're saying makes sense, but it worked for muebe, so... i can't see why it wouldn't work for me. perhaps a T-pipe on it's side would be better... a drop hole AND a chimney, with the feed in the side.
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af233/quarlow/Picture009.jpg)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af233/quarlow/Picture011.jpg)
Quote from: mrphilips on October 23, 2011, 12:58:12 PM
i think i was getting a fire-in-the-hole scenario... flaming pukes and a creep-back of char. when i finally disconnected everything, my pucks were showing signs of it.
And that is where the heatsinks help. There is a lot of heat build-up in that pipe because it is confined in that small space. The heatsinks help cool the area down above the generator heating element. I really suggest you install some heatsinks...
A T- pipe would work very well
much better... maybe 10% loss/back-up:
(http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd408/mrphilips/IMG00362-20111023-1606.jpg)
perhaps i will try the t-pipe, but this is a much better result, regardless of the heat-sink issues.
(maybe i will just try the cardboard box while i'm at it too)
There would be a lot of heat with Muebe's set up cause you have pipe right above the burner. The cardboard box like I made from the plans of someone else never had a problem with heat as it all goes straight up the pipe. So you will need the heatsinks.
Even 10% going threw the SG is not good. You need to have no smoke coming threw that Generator.
Here is a full view of my setup...
(http://i752.photobucket.com/albums/xx169/muebe/IMAG1574.jpg)
(http://i752.photobucket.com/albums/xx169/muebe/IMAG1575.jpg)
You can see that it leaves the generator at a slight angle and then 90 degree elbow to straight up. Then at the top there is a slight bend into the smoker.
If you get your run straight up to the smoker you should have zero smoke loss coming back out the generator. So just add a adjustable 90 degree elbow to the end then hook the flex pipe to it.
it's not 10% when the wind blows, it's more.
think i can clean the unit up inside if it gets too bad?
how does your cardboard box deal with the heat? how hot does your oven get (when off) with your box set-up?
not really sure i'm following you muebe... i don't see how the 90 degree elbow differs much from what i have at the end of mine, and if it is a bit of a sharper angle, it's certainly not by that much...
i have smoke billowing out the vents at the back of the smoke generator.
i did not get burn-back this time, but the gumminess is going to become a problem and 10-20% loss is still too much...
curious to see how hot quarlow's box leaves the smoke in the chamber... it may be easier to just use a box.
my set up has to be torn down and rebuilt every time i use it, so disposable pieces may be best anyway.
MrPhillips
The only difference that I can see between a cold smoke adapter or a carboard box and using the Y is the fact that you are allowing air to be introduced after the burner. This is where you are trying to create a draw. I suspect you are real close to getting it but the wind is probably blowing air up the dump portion of the Y and creating the backdraft. I also suspect the reason Muebe's doesn't have a problem with a backdraft is it's in a cabinet. To test this theory just try covering the dump portion of the Y while it's running and see if it corrects itself.
Mike
Your pipe does not go straight up and that is the problem. The travel from the bottom to the top needs to go straight up. An adjustable elbow will allow you to get the degree that you need to go straight up with the pipe. If you add a tee to the y-pipe it will be beyond 90 degrees because the y-pipe has to be raised up on an angle slightly to keep the smoke from coming back out the generator.
The reason why the cold smoke box and cardboard box work is because the pipe comes straight up out of the top. And there is enough room in the box for the smoke to rise and go out. You do not have that advantage with a y-pipe setup.
And if you omit the y-pipe setup then the spent pucks will have no where to go ;D
i'm going to have to think about this for a bit.
i don't think i'm following you at all, though it seems it should be easy enough...
my y-pipe is designed slightly differently from yours... it seems a fair bit longer, and i think that's more of an issue than the angle of my up-pipe. honestly, i hear what you're saying but i don't see that much of a difference in the angles from these pics, but as i said - maybe i'm missing something.
but i wasn't sugegsting i omit the y-pipe, just throw the metal dish in the cardboard box, or use the t-pipe.
mr walleye - good testing point.
next time i get it all out i'll try that, but where i am - on a deck on the thrid-floor - i think wind is the bigger issue and even if i block that dump, it's not going to get much better.
i think i'll try the cardboard next - or build a cabinet for everything. will post back with deets and pics when i get there!
I added a red line to your picture to try and convey what I am talking about...
(http://i752.photobucket.com/albums/xx169/muebe/pipe.jpg)
I smoke in the cooler temps with a bowl of ice inside. My temps were 70 to 75 degrees which I would like the temp to have been higheer. Like 85 to 95. I just need to put less ice in the pan I used.
ok, i see what you're saying.
i'd need the elbow and a bit of re-positioning... which i could do, but now i have my doubts that that in itself will fix it - i think the draw would definitely be assisted by it, but that the ever-present wind would be more of a restricting factor over-all
as walleye said, as soon as it breaths into the dump-end, i'd lose that gentle draw... what do you think about that?
i can block the wind a bit, but i am up in the clouds here...
Place a tall metal paint bucket underneath the puck dump tube on the y-pipe so it can catch the burn pucks but also protect the pipe from the incoming wind...
that's a thought!
hey, with all this ingenuity going around, i'm still stuck with a question... wouldn't the cardboard box just be easier?
i like to macguyver as much as the next guy, but... what in your opinion (and walleye's too, if you're still on here) is the draw backs to the box?
The way I see it and I am no pro, but the cardboard box acts as a plenum. It allows just the right amount of air go up the pipe. If you have to much air going up the pipe it spoils inside and the draw is effected. If you don't have enough you get a similar effect.
If you use a T-pipe it should line up with the burner so the heat causes the smoke to rise straight up the pipe via convection. You may also need to put a damper on the bottom side so that you don't get to much air going into the pipe. Of course then you would have to tip the damper down to let the pucks drop into the bowl. You could rig it up so the damper would tip when the puck dropped but returns to closed after the puck dropped out which may take some balancing with weights or something.
It would be fun to tinker with but why?
One of the nicest ones I have seen was made with a unused hydraulic tank from Princess Auto which he cut a door into the front and put a pipe out the top. shortly after Bradley came out with there version for about what it cost him to build his. That said I will still build my own when I find time as I like to make stuff.
Well there is a durability issue with cardboard obviously....
I would use the cold smoker setup that uses the metal mailbox IMHO if you are not going to stick with the y-pipe design. That seems like the most simple and cost effective design.
You can add some pipe to the y-pipe puck dump tube to decrease the wind entering into it and use a large metal bucket. That should create enough protection from the wind.
I agree Muebe, the box won't last long and could dry to the point of being combustable and unsafe.
The mailbox is a great option and it looks so cool too.
i'm nodding silently and contemplating.
i reject the mailbox option at the moment as my tin-snipping is deplorable and i doin't trust the silicon stuff.
i think i may have alreday spent more on this that the adapter costs to buy...
I feel the same about the silicone,but I think you could use that foil duct tape.
while my HOT-SMOKED chicken cooks, and seeing as you guys have been so encouraging, i'll give you a brief history...
i bought the BPS.
it works but is touchy, uncontrolable temperature-wise and a fair amount of work.
i put a cardboard box on it temporarily for a cold-smoker, and it worked once... twice... three times...
then i got lazy, looked the other way and while the fire engulfed my smoker and the box and the pipe and the barbeque cover and some of the deck, i received unhappy conversation from my wife.
so i bought the mailbox, which also worked a bit... but was too hot (i front-mounted it cause of afore-mentioned concerns and wasn't sure about the vent-tape - stuff gets really hot) and that caused the drier-vent pipe to burn a bit, making everything taste like aluminum.
the BPS burns P (propane), which produces water, and everything not only cold-smokes, but cold steams, and it's messy and i got fed up - especially considering it doesn't even hot-smoke well, in my opinion.
so i bought the BOS? (original smoker) when it went on sale at Canadian Tire, and here we are.
so yes - i trust you when you say the box might burn - but that was propane, electric is much less likely.
Quote from: Quarlow on October 23, 2011, 02:44:53 PM
One of the nicest ones I have seen was made with a unused hydraulic tank from Princess Auto which he cut a door into the front and put a pipe out the top. shortly after Bradley came out with there version for about what it cost him to build his. That said I will still build my own when I find time as I like to make stuff.
Thanks Q... That's my setup. :D
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v158/mmike/Fishing%20Photos/IMGP0369-s.jpg)
Mike
damn, that's a nice one, walleye
That's the beauty. Sorry I didn't know who's it was but I have a memory like a sieve with the bottom knocked out.
MrPhillips
I just re-read some of the posts and see your smoker set up is on the third floor. The wind pressure will definitely be more difficult to control there especially with that particular setup. When you use the cold smoke adapter, be it the real macoy or a cardboard box, the only place air can draw from is through the generator. It the wind blows the only thing it can do is increase the flow not stop it which is what is occurring now.
I know from experience the larger the wall (think your house here) the more pressure the wind has against it. A number of years ago I used to look after an 86 suite apt. building. When it would rain with wind, up on the 7th to 9th floor, the windows would fill with water and literally look like an aquarium. There was enough wind pressure on the side of the building to push the rain through the small drain holes on the bottom of the window sill.
Mike
i'm getting that, yeah...
at this point now - since i'm not moving anytime soon ;) - i'm trying to figure out the best solution to over-come it.
it seems whatever i do, it'll have to be tight against the wind... that y-pipe end may be the real culprit then. it's too open. i'm not sure the best move to make next, but i'm still thinking a well-watched cardboard box may be the best considering the options... it's temporary and iffy, yes - but tight and disposable too.
one day i will buy my own house and have a garage...
Thanks guys
I built it just before Bradley came out with theirs. Go figure! ::) :D
Mike
You already have the pipe, all you need is a cardboard box. I think this is worth a shot. If it works well you can always buy a cold smoke adaptor later.
Mike
i think that's my next step.
Quote from: Mr Walleye on October 23, 2011, 03:47:54 PM
Thanks guys
I built it just before Bradley came out with theirs. Go figure! ::) :D
Mike
Mike,
Yours is much better. After going through a few cardboard boxes, I purchased the Bradley Cold Smoke Adapter. I wished they made it a little bigger, so I could fit my hot plate inside to use for smoking other woods. Took me a while to find a hot plate that would fit inside.
Thanks Habs
I have used it to burn other woods as well. I can't remember the actual dimensions but I think it's about 14 x 14 or 16 x 16 and about 12 or 14 inches high. It's definitely solid enough. ;D
Mike
PS
I just ment back and looked when I built it and it's 16 x 16 x 16.
guys, i had a late thought: a wooden box would have essentially the same types of concerns as a cardboard box, but be significatly more robust and re-usable, and also significatly more heat-resistent... right?
i am considering wood just because i can work with it quite easily (unlike cutting metal) and because usable found objects are commonly available... a couple of drawers from a tossed-out chest or something.
Wood would be more robust than cardboard and less flammable than cardboard. But it is still combustable so you really would have to watch it as much as cardboard. Oh I just had a thought. Dang it's a good one too. I have a large coffee can that will work perfect. If I can get it away from Wombat (that would be my wife). She is using it for change but it would take 200 years to fill it. Hmmm.
i'm thinking if the wood is thick enough (3/4"?), and the box is big enough, there's enough heat distribution to far exceed the cardboard's tolerance. i could also use the "smoker" end of my maverick dual probe thermometer in the cold-adapter to assess heat build-up in there.... and since none of this is intended to function without close supervision, i may just try that out and be satisfied... but metal is obviously superior.
what size coffe can are you talking about?
I think you will be as successful as the card board box, actually more so cause you can put a hinged door on it. It will work fine. Here is the coffee can I have.
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af233/quarlow/coldsmoker002.jpg)
This is going to work great. But Wombat is hating me right now. LOL.
If you get your chimney right over the puck burner the heat will shoot right up it and you won't have too much build up of heat in a wood box.
that's a big can, lol.
thinking...
I've got quite a few tool boxes. Think I may use one of the utility boxes. Turn it on its side and use the top lid as the door. Hey it's here ,free and not being used. LOL
Haha I got that from one of the docks we go to here in vancouver. The company paid for all the coffee they drank. Of course the longshoremen in charge would make us drivers pay for the coffee but they would donate the money to a christmas charity in ours and their name which was nice that they acknowledged us. They drank a lot of coffee there. That is a twenty pound can.
A tool box will work good. I looked at them also. I just didn't want to pay for something cause I like to reuse other things so they don't end up in the trash. If you have a tool box use it. It is kind of cool to see who can come up with something unusual for a cold smoker. I still love the mailbox, but this coffee can, I think is unique.
Yes I'd rather have the coffee also. It is unique and Good looking. But as you said the box is here and I also like to recycle. Never have I seen a coffee container that big.
Hey Quarlow
Are you a "can" hauler from the port ?
Jim O
yeah i am.
so... i've gotten this far on recycled/available stuff in my spare room:
(http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd408/mrphilips/IMG00374-20111105-1851-1.jpg)
it's 3/4" russion birch plywood.
not sure how great the glue/chemical situation is but i'm hoping :P the chamber gets a good coating of smoke-tar which would keep anything nasty from coming in?
fits the smoke generator snugly, the pipe extends directly above the smoke plate and it has that open door in the back for access...
next stop, test it out for temp control.
i may need to add some heat diffusers... i'm thinking closed-off copper pipes stuffed down tight holes in the top and extending up a foot or so, to draw excess heat out, but we'll see how bad it gets in there after an hour or two.
Very nice work MP. I can only sayn that as a child my dad built UPS's (ugly plywood smokers) out of ordinary plywood and I am still alive. I seem to be normal( and I use this term loosely) with no limbs falling off or anything weird......ok maybe weird is the wrong way to put but you get my drift. ;D ;D ;D
Plywood does have some nasty chemicals. But have seen many smokers made from them. Haven't heard or seen any one hurt because of it. But the dryer wood gets the lower the flash point. I have know them to burst into flames even at low temps. So be careful!
Many smokers are made from plywood, if your interested in building one i posted a how to back in march.
http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=21343.msg260280#msg260280
devo how do you deal with the burner creating ash out of the burn wood? My dad would burn his wood to ash and that as we now know is the bad part. Plus it does give off an acrid taste.
I never did build one. Never found the time but the fellow who gave me the plans swears by his. I think Kirby (pickman_95) use's a very simular setup for the burner but i'm not sure. Maybe they use pellets instead of wood.
Oh my mistake I thought that was your build. I guess I should have looked closer. I think I would go with the Bradley SG. It is a clean simple set up.
Nice build on the box. Look very nice.
Quote from: viper125 on November 05, 2011, 06:45:19 PM
Plywood does have some nasty chemicals. But have seen many smokers made from them. Haven't heard or seen any one hurt because of it. But the dryer wood gets the lower the flash point. I have know them to burst into flames even at low temps. So be careful!
viper you are correct that wood can get a lower flash point. Pyrophoric carbon can and will ignite at a temperature as low as 170 degrees F. To get this type of build up you will have to have the wood exposed to heat for an extended period of time. I am not convinced that using a wood box for a cold smoker is going to have the heat and extended time to create pyrophoric carbon.
I built a cardboard box with the smoke vent offset of the puck burner. I even had the vent attachement set down into the cold smoker 4 inches hoping to trap the heat before it rolled down the 4 inches to get to the chimney. What I found is that the ambient air was 77 degrees and when I fired the SG the cabinet temp climbed to 96 degrees. After 1 hr the cabinet temp climbed to 101 and held. I was getting lots of heat coming into the cabinet from the generator. This is not a problem for those that live in the cold north as you need that heat. Living in Florida I need to really cool the smoke. I put an ice pan on the bottom rack and got the temp to 75 degrees. Had to run the heating element to get the cabinet temp to 85 for my cheese smoke.
I am thinking that I will build a box that has a metal top where I can place as pan of ice to wick the heat before it goes up the chimney.
thanks for some knoweldable confirmation!
first - the length of the metal pipe will greatly reduce the heat going to the chamber... the longer it is, the more chance it gets to radiate and be absorbed by the metal, so there's a factor as well...
BUT i like where you're going with the metal top... i still don't want to work with tin, but you've given me an idea:
perhaps my buddy with the jig-saw can cut me a loaf-tin sized hole in the top that i can wedge a loaf-tin into and fill with ice... the metal would absorb heat and i could drop ice cubes into it to cool the interior of the chamber.
will look into that after a my test-burn gives me the actual results
Or build a shelf above the burner for a low side pan to sit with ice. Small enough for smoke to wick around. The ice and pan should catch the heat and smoke should continue on.
so, here's the completed unit with loaf-tin installed and the access door open...
(http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd408/mrphilips/IMG00389-20111119-1148.jpg)
...generator fits snugly against the one side...
(http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd408/mrphilips/IMG00390-20111119-1149.jpg)
...complete setup with elevated smoke-chamber...
(http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd408/mrphilips/IMG00388-20111119-1123.jpg)
...and the results:
the weather man said it was 11C/52F out.
my maverick told me it was 15C/59F... perhaps cause everything had just come out of the warm house.
anyway, i'm still on the thrid floor and it was - again - a windy day, but after 30min to warm up the generator and an hour of smoking, the cold-smoke adapter got up to 44C/112F and the chamber got up to 22C/72F.
by my calculations, that's an increase of only 7C/13F in the chamber. technically too cold to smoke cheese (which i've read is best at 32C/90F), but i could heat the baby up before hand i think...
in the summer, the temp should be perfect.
and i feel pretty secure that the adaptor-chamber is not getting too hot at all, so that's good news.
now, as i said, it was windy and the wind across the top the smoke chamber was causing some back-flow... but only a wee bit. considering the weather, i think that's ok. there's smoke leakage around the aluminum pipe up at the chamber and some around the loaf-tin, but again... not much at all.
perhaps i didn't need the loaf-tin... after the fire i had, i was feeling cautious!
I like the cold smoke adapter with the tin. I have been playing around with this idea in my head. Have you put ice in the pan to see how much head it takes out of the smoke? I bet that if you put ice in the pan that your Bradley chamber temp will be close to or lower than the ambient outside temp.
Did I miss something. You said you had a fire?
Quote from: Sailor on November 19, 2011, 09:33:21 AM
I like the cold smoke adapter with the tin. I have been playing around with this idea in my head. Have you put ice in the pan to see how much head it takes out of the smoke? I bet that if you put ice in the pan that your Bradley chamber temp will be close to or lower than the ambient outside temp.
hello sailor...
... the simple answer is no. but yes, that's the whole plan.
well, half the plan.
muebe was using copper heat sinks on his get-up, and i figured the insulating factor of plywood would be greater than his aluminum pipes, so i feared it would get too hot.
someone (sorry - ferget who) mentioned using metal somewhere in the construction, which sparked my idea... so the tin has a dual purpose: a heat sink to decrease the heat by simple conduction, and also an option to go the extra step and fill it with ice!
i haven't tried it like that yet... the temp in the chamber seemed fine for the peppercorns i was smoking, but i figure the option to ice the chamber will help when cold-smoking fish and cheese, depending on the ambient.
i'm not 100% on my snuff, but i think there's optimum absorbtion-based temperatures for different foods, and i may have actually over-cooled it... most recipes i see say to smoke cheese at 85-95F.
Quote from: Quarlow on November 19, 2011, 09:40:34 AM
Did I miss something. You said you had a fire?
yup, :-[ ...
i put minor details up in the thread a few pages back.
basically, my BPS with cardboard-box adapter worked a few times and i got configdent and careless, and when 1 minute it was fine, the next it was alight.
i lost the cardboard box (no biggie), a temperature probe, the barbeque cover (remarkably, the barbeque was fine), an aluminum pipe, did some serious work to my BPS generator after the dry-chem fire-extinguisher was used, a massive clean-up, minor damage to the deck, no sex for about 2 days (she doesn't like wildfires) and as a renter... well, i lost about a year of my life over the stress.
anyhoo, i built a new adaptor quickly to smoke the 6lbs of sausage i had made the day before and the three racks of cheese, but new from that point on i was a) done with the propane smoker (never worked well anyway) and b) needed a better adaptor.
today i am happy and my wife loves me :D
I am not expert on cheese but I think I read where cheese should be between 80 and 90 degrees as anything over 90 may melt it. When I did my load of cheese I had a big pan of ice on the lower rack and the temp was around 75. I hooked up my PID and maintained 85 degrees using the element. I am betting that the Ice in your bread pan will cool the cabinet temp down. I am going to build one like yours I think. Really would be interested in seeing how much yours cools down if you put ice in it. I want to be able to smoke cheese when the outside temp is in the 90's and Ice in the cabinet and in the adapter might just be the ticket for me to drop the temp down 5 to 10 degrees.
it should probably work for you exactly as you're suggesting... and all in all, even if you didn't have the wood lying around, not a pricey or difficult set up at all. yay home depot.
with everything i've tried thus far, and everything i've snooped in the forum... and all the sage advice from all my forum friends, or course - i think this is the best set up for me.
muebe's was awesome, but i needed something "tighter" due to the airflow needs within the set up and the windiness of living 30 feet above street level, and this box has more or less done it.
(a little leakage here and there... haven't solved that yet. suggestions appreciated)
tell ya what, i'll head down to florida and watch you build yours for a week or two. i'll pass the beer. and pretend to feel badly for your excessive ambient temps... ;D
and to be completely honest with you, i've smoked cheese with the cardboard adaptor and propane smoker a number of times, sometimes too cold (low 70s), sometimes too hot (high 90s), and it's always deliscious. i think we're talking about true optimum's here, not mandatories. obviously, too hot and it'll sweat and then melt, but i'm not sure how bad too cold really gets.
as big of an issue for me was the fact that the BPS produces massive amounts of steam when the propane burns. the chamber practically rained in there, and everything was dripping wet afterwards and needed to dry out before being put away. definitly happy to leave that unit at the cottage and move on to the OBS
To seal up your pan you might go to Home Depot and get some round plastic that is used to secure screen. I bet you could wrap it at the top where the lip is and then force down and you would get a seal.
i know the stuff... sorta soft plastic stuff. could work and i doubt the heat/chemicals would be a problem as it's essentially outside of the box, or just barely in contact with the inner air.
as for sealing the aluminum tube where it enters the chamber... i guess a few wraps of dish towel or something would work. the only fear of ignition would be if i did end up turning on the chamber too to raise the heat, but it could probably still be done safely.
i shall tweak and repost.