BRADLEY SMOKER | "Taste the Great Outdoors"

Consumables and Accessories => Accessories => Topic started by: msiler on May 19, 2004, 03:50:05 AM

Title: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on May 19, 2004, 03:50:05 AM
I figured that this may fit here a bit better now.

Ok I am ready to call testing complete and share plans...
Sorry it took so long folks.

It does seem to have extended my cook time somewhat.... Probably due to better control ie. no overtemp excursions etc.In order to help with extended times etc.   I use a foil cake pan for water since it holds more and will not dry out as fast.

The way I have wired it there are no modifications to the smoker just plug it in between the smoke generator and the main box and run the probe in through the vent and hang with some stainless wire. I looped the extra capillary tube and stored it under the back cover.

I also limited travel of the temp knob on mine as to not be able to accidently overtemp, I did this with a small pin drilled into the knob and another into the face of the box.

If you do not feel up to this task and still want one let me know and I will see what I can do to help.


Parts required:

1 Oven thermostat Part No. RS-5430-175 ($62.65 at Partsguy.com)
1 computer cord make sure it's same gauge or heavier than smoker cord
1 box at least 3x3x2 internal dimensions
solder and heat shrink

Here is the wiring diagram

(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-3/687563/tempcontrol.JPG)


When in doubt smoke it.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Chez Bubba on May 20, 2004, 01:30:04 AM
Martin,

Help out us "electrically-challenged" folks please. (Or maybe I'm the only one as no one else has posted.) What does L1, L2, 1, 2, 3, & 4 refer to? Hey, at least I knew what Black, White & Green were![:D]

Also, what was your reasoning in limiting the travel of the temp slider? I would think, and I've already pronounced my illiteracy in this area, that you would want to turn it up as high as possible & let the thermostat regulate it down when necessary.

Thanks for sharing your research.[:)]

Kirk

http://www.chezbubba.com
Ya think next time I check into a hotel & they ask "Smoking or Non?" they would mind?
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Chez Bubba on May 20, 2004, 02:09:54 AM
I agree, this is where this thread belongs. So that we are not carrying on 2 sets of conversations, I shut down the other thread. To view previous commentary, go to http://www.bradleysmoker.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=197


http://www.chezbubba.com
Ya think next time I check into a hotel & they ask "Smoking or Non?" they would mind?
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on May 20, 2004, 02:28:51 AM
L1,L2 etc... That is how the terminals are labeled on the controller.

I limited the travel on the temp knob not the slider. The thermstat has capability of controlling ovens up to 500 degrees. As I recall the bradley book has a caution about not exceeding 300 or 350 degrees to avoid damaging the unit (probably the door seal).
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: snapper39 on May 20, 2004, 02:35:17 AM
Martin I have all the required parts, but am having a bit of a time figuring out the wiring, I plan to cut the cord to my hotplate ( I have a smoke generator )and wire it to the thermostat any suggestions?
Snap

I'd walk a thousand miles to smoke a "Camel"
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on May 20, 2004, 03:01:17 AM
If you know what pins are what, it should be a fairly simple task. The accepted practice is to always switch the power input (Black wire in 120V household wiring)If you want an easy way wire up using a heavy 4-6 foot extension cord, this will make sure the wires are the proper colors. If cut into the cord on the hotplate it may not be color coded. If you have the diagrams that came with the thermostat and can't figure them out scan them email to me and I will try to help.

When in doubt smoke it.

Edit: Hey it looks like I've been promoted.... Look at all them stars....
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Chez Bubba on May 20, 2004, 03:55:17 AM
Ten hut, colonel![:D]

Congrats![8D]

http://www.chezbubba.com
Ya think next time I check into a hotel & they ask "Smoking or Non?" they would mind?
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: snapper39 on May 21, 2004, 02:37:30 AM
Martin You da man!!
I will scan and email the schematic before weeks end.
Thanks for the help.
Snap

I'd walk a thousand miles to smoke a "Camel"
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Chez Bubba on May 25, 2004, 03:54:57 AM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by msiler</i>
<br />As I recall the bradley book has a caution about not exceeding 300 or 350 degrees to avoid damaging the unit (probably the door seal).
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
As well as the insulation (foam).

http://www.chezbubba.com
Ya think next time I check into a hotel & they ask "Smoking or Non?" they would mind?
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Oldman on May 26, 2004, 11:22:40 PM
Crap if it is not business, it is all these Pros E-mailing me about these "funny" Pineapples....now msiler comes up with a better than super glue plan that I just don't understand...Crap-O-La~~!

Ok msiler would you, once you feel it is all together and well tested,  consider selling me one of those? I would expect you to make a profit. Believe me I make a profit on my work. What do ya say....help an oldman get across the street?

Olds.
 
 
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on May 27, 2004, 04:14:35 AM
Hey Olds,

Testing is complete and i have been running it for about 2 months of steady weekend smokes.

I would consider putting one together for you. I am not in a position to offer warranty etc... So you would have to assume any liability for it's use.
I know that it works and in my opinion works very well. I just need to make sure that we are on the same page.

That being said.
My cost for parts comes to $75 after tax and shipping is $5-$6
How would $90 sound total delivered?
Let me know what you think.

When in doubt smoke it.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Chez Bubba on May 27, 2004, 05:38:38 AM
Martin,

I too would be interested, $90 sounds fine, & I agree to the legal crap. It's a shame our world has come to the point where this would even be a concern.[:(]

Smokin' buddies should be able to help each other out. People need to take responsibility for themselves again, not rely on shamans to magically lift them into the world of luxury.

Email me the send-to-info & we'll get a check out.

Kirk

http://www.chezbubba.com
Ya think next time I check into a hotel & they ask "Smoking or Non?" they would mind?
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: nsxbill on July 06, 2004, 03:08:52 PM
Hello Martin,

I am a newbie owner in California. Have been lurking in the background for several weeks, and now have a stainless model on the way to me.  Your thermostatic control looks like the missing item that to me fills the void in controlling the BS.   I would like to purchase one of your controllers for my new smoker.  

If you are ready to make us happy with your prototype, I certainly want to get in the line to get one.  I, of course, release you from all responsibility should any unforseen accident or unit failure result from the use of the controller.

Would you accept Paypal as a payment option?

I might even take it apart and put it in a stainless box to match my unit, unless you plan on also producing in SS??

Let me know when you are ready and will get the payment to you in any form that works for you.

Bill M  &lt;nsxbill@yahoo.com&gt;
Cameron Park, CA
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: nsxbill on July 08, 2004, 07:45:13 PM
M Siler

Not getting back to me, did a visit to Partsguy.com, and using the number for the part you posted up, got no hits.  What is the SKU or the actual part name and number.  The reference RS-5430-175 gave no return for oven thermostat.

Thanks
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: imott on August 09, 2004, 08:17:33 PM
msiler,

Partsguy.com now has this item listed at $164.49. I found it using a partial part number (5430-175). Is this the correct item?

Thx
i
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: nsxbill on August 09, 2004, 10:51:44 PM
M. Siler hasn't responded to inquiries-no longer around?  He offered to help others, but maybe overwhelmed with demands of those life and family related non-smoker things, and really didn't want to get into making controllers?   Has been silent for awhile.

To meet my needs for this, I am getting a controller from the following location:  http://www.thebbqguru.com/ramp_mode.htm

They are making up a Bradley compatable unit for me.  I suspect the cost will be around $250 +/-, and if you have another pit, weber, Green Egg, you can get the damper control and use it with the pit.  They make a bunch of different applications.

Will keep all posted on the progress and how it works once I get it.  http://forum.bradleysmoker.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=400

Bill
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on August 10, 2004, 10:28:02 PM
Sorry guys....
I have been offline for a while. Had to move to Abilene TX... But I will try to catch up at least once a week..

When in doubt smoke it.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on August 11, 2004, 07:07:32 PM
I just got back from the local used appliance place with my free thermostat.  I'll pick up a box and try and put this together soon.  I'd like to mount this to the side of the smoker that the smoke box is mounted to.  Does anybody know if there are any wires inside the smoker wall?  I'm looking for a safe place to drill a hole for the probe and screw in some sheet metal screws.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on August 11, 2004, 10:35:16 PM
I did a little browsing through my Mouser catalog and ordered up the following parts for the controller (Aluminum box, male cable 16 Gauge with stripped wires, female cable 16 Gauge with stripped wires):

STOCK NUMBER        ORDERED AVAILABILITY             PRICE  Ext. Price
======================================================================
686-17520           1       1 Ships Immediately      4.650  4.650

686-17514           1       1 Ships Immediately      4.250  4.250

546-1411FU          1       1 Ships Immediately      4.170  4.170




Merchandise Amount: 13.070
Shipping: To Be Determined

http://www.mouser.com/catalog.cfm

Thought I'd post to give some ideas to everyone.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Chez Bubba on August 12, 2004, 03:50:01 AM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by rgardjr</i>
<br />Does anybody know if there are any wires inside the smoker wall?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I don't BELIEVE there are any wires in there but have never hacked one apart far enough to verify that. There is insulation and un-sealing that may lead to some performance issues if it's not re-sealed. (In my mind.)

Kirk

http://www.chezbubba.com
Ya think next time I check into a hotel & they ask "Smoking or Non?" they would mind?
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Sesh on August 12, 2004, 02:38:39 PM
I'm planning on attaching a piece of flexible magnetic sheeting to one side of the project box so I can just stick it wherever I want on the Bradley.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on August 12, 2004, 07:35:13 PM
I have had mine apart far enough to see where all the wires are. They are all under the back panel and under the unit.

When in doubt smoke it.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Eat This on August 13, 2004, 06:50:26 AM
for $100.00 to $250.00....Ill just slide a switch and keep my warranty....I assume most considering this are out of the warranty period......but to be honest I'm not sure an oven thermostat is really that accurate. I have sold appliances for years now....HIGH end jobbers like $6,000 refrigerators that you cant even fit a Pizza box in...LOL....most regular grade thermostats are gonna be +/- 12 degrees (depending on cavity size and where its located)......so break out the Maverick and save the cash....IMHO.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on August 16, 2004, 07:05:47 PM
It's costing me less than $20 to do this.  I'll still use the Maverick to make sure that the temperature is being regulated.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Eat This</i>
<br />for $100.00 to $250.00....Ill just slide a switch and keep my warranty....I assume most considering this are out of the warranty period......but to be honest I'm not sure an oven thermostat is really that accurate. I have sold appliances for years now....HIGH end jobbers like $6,000 refrigerators that you cant even fit a Pizza box in...LOL....most regular grade thermostats are gonna be +/- 12 degrees (depending on cavity size and where its located)......so break out the Maverick and save the cash....IMHO.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on August 17, 2004, 10:09:13 PM
Well I finally put it all together today.  I'll fire it up when I get home to see how well it works.  I'll keep updating my progress.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on August 18, 2004, 12:40:17 AM
mine has about a + or - 3 degree swing

I did find a cheaper thermostat but it had a swing of close to  + or - 10 degrees. of course it only cost about 40 bucks

When in doubt smoke it.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on August 18, 2004, 07:23:17 PM
Well I tested it out a little last night with mixed results.  It would regulate the temperature, but I couldn't get it down to the 200-215 range where I wanted it.  The free thermostat doesn't turn on until about 240.  Anyway, I was looking for thermostats and I came accross deep fryer replacement thermostats and wanted someone elses opinion.  The one I saw had a operating range of 175 to 375 and was set up for 120.  My only concern is that the thermostat capilary is designed to sit in hot oil-I'm assuming that it should work fine in a hot smoker as well.  What do you think?
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on August 18, 2004, 09:28:23 PM
It my not work as well due to less efficient heat transfer of air versus oil. but may be wrong. I will be contacting an appliance parts dealer in my new location to see if i can figure out the problem with the part #.

When in doubt smoke it.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: pandjspell on August 19, 2004, 09:59:00 PM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by msiler</i>
<br />It my not work as well due to less efficient heat transfer of air versus oil. but may be wrong. I will be contacting an appliance parts dealer in my new location to see if i can figure out the problem with the part #.

When in doubt smoke it.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Did you ever get an answer as to why the RS-5430-175 part number for the thermostat is not listed on the Partsguy.com website?

Do you have another thermostat part number?

Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: imott on August 19, 2004, 11:18:03 PM
I got no reply so I started my own investigation and found the 5300-615 for about $87. Put it together and it works. Although I have come to discover that having the thermostat regulate when the heating element comes on and goes off might not be the best thing for a constant low and slow cook. What I mean is that when the temp drops and the thermostat switches the heating element on, it comes on at full blast blaring until it reaches temp. Then, when the thermostat switches off, the heating element goes to completely off. Denying the meat from any direct heat. From my understanding, we are trying to emulate old style smoking with a new tech smoker. Fire does not go on and off like this. I am starting to believe that, if one wants tempurature regulation, we might steer away from switching the heating element on and off and toward a method of controlling the voltage to the heating element in a more gradual way. This way the heat applied will be constant.

I have also discovered that the temp swings are much more than the differential indicated on the thermostat (8F) depending upon where in the smoking chamber the thermostat's remote bulb is placed. With the remote bulb hanging in the center of the BS, just below the second shelf right next to the probe on my Maverick, the Maverick indicates a temp of almost 125F before the thermostat which is set to 100F switches off! Then, once the thermostat is off, it does not switch back on until the Maverick indicates approx 87F. Similiar behavior occurs at higher temps as well. These tests have been done with an empty BS. I will be trying them out again next time I do a Pork Butt or Brisket.

Boy...What a mouthful!!! These are just my observations...In search for nothing to do but eat!!!

i
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Sesh on August 20, 2004, 04:08:40 PM
I think I found the same thermostat msiler is using at www.patriot-supply.com.  Search for part number 5430-175 and it will come up as a Robert Shaw brand DOM.ELEC.STAT MASTER KIT,60" for $33.63.  With UPS ground shipping my total was $38.21.  I used to have some project boxes but couldn't find them so it looks like I'm off to RadioShack for that.  In doing some research into thermostats on the internet I found manufacturers technical documents that allowed for a thermostat to go as much as 25 degrees over set temperature and be in spec.  If I can get a six degree range (+ or - 3) like msiler describes I'll  be very happy.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on August 27, 2004, 12:31:41 AM
msiler: Does this look correct?


(http://www.repairclinic.com/dbimages/00000683/00206879.jpg)
(http://www.repairclinic.com/dbimages/00000682/00206717.jpg)

Found it here:
http://www.repairclinic.com/0081.asp?RccPartID=646732&SeqID=0&Chg=3
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on August 30, 2004, 10:58:28 PM
Is it the same??? No not quite.... Will it work???? Most certainly yes it will.

Any oven thermostat will work some will have a bigger temp swing than others.. I just lucked out the one I picked had a small swing.. any helpful local appliance repair shop should be able to help quite a lot.

When in doubt smoke it.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on August 31, 2004, 05:26:35 AM
The main reason I was asking was because it showed up when I searched for the part number listed on the first page.  It didn't looked like your ascii diagram so I wanted to check.  I ordered the one from Patriot supply listed on the previos page.  Total was $38 including 2nd day shipping (which I didn't ask for, but got for the ground price).  It will be here tommorow and I'll update when I have some testing completed.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: imott on August 31, 2004, 05:58:05 PM
msiler,

Where is the BS do you suggest putting the probe?

i
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: msiler on August 31, 2004, 07:52:19 PM
I currently have mine fed in through the vent but after my warranty is out i will drill in from the back. of course at that time i will also be doubling the shelf capacity for sausage.... 16 racks of sausage at a time..... mmmmmmm (well that is the preliminary plan anyway.

When in doubt smoke it.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: imott on August 31, 2004, 08:59:00 PM
msiler

OK. I got that part from reading earlier in the thread. What I meant was...Where exactly does the probe live once it is inside the BS? Is it mounted somewhere? Does it hang just inside the vent? Halfway down? Right above the heating element?

Thanks again,
i
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on August 31, 2004, 10:32:19 PM
Received the thermostat from Patriot Supply and upon intitial inspection it looks like the same one msiler has been using successfully.  I test it out tonight.  Hopefully the sensitivity will be as accurate +-3.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: Oldman on August 31, 2004, 11:26:33 PM
I might be all wet here, but is there not a dual probe unit where you can manually set the spread? Also I wonder if the unit being turn on and off every minute or so if that would that hurt or shorten the life of the heating unit.
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: imott on September 01, 2004, 01:25:38 AM
DoW-Oldman
That is what I was discussing in my reply a few posts ago. My idea is to use a PID controller to ramp the voltage up and down as necessary to keep the temp stable at the desire level.
i
Title: Re: Temp control plans
Post by: rgardjr on September 01, 2004, 07:05:21 AM
Just finished up testing and the new thermostat is working great.  Had an 8 degree swing, which I find acceptable.  I'm planning on doing a shoulder this weekend I'll let everyone know how it goes.