Author Topic: Gun Powder Seasoning  (Read 40720 times)

Offline KyNola

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #30 on: February 09, 2011, 09:14:27 am »
Maybe I can help a little.  In another thread it was disclosed that the mysterious gunpowder rub being sold through Star Market is actually this stuff: www.sureshotsids.com

TMB was able to do a little recon and uncovered this info when he went to pick up 10.5's 5 pound order of the stuff.

Offline BuyLowSellHigh

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #31 on: February 09, 2011, 09:29:02 am »
O
Thanks, KyN - that helps a bit.

From another website, Sureshot Sid's described their product thusly,

Sure Shot Sids' Gunpowder Seasoning is a meat rub that gives you the taste of Charcoal grilled flavors used indoors or on the grill for added flavors. It's the Seasoning Fine Steak Houses use to give that grilled flavor to their steaks. It can be used on almost any food product for exceptional taste. It is not hot in flavor! But it will explode the flavors in your meats, seafoods or vegetables. Excellent product to use on wild game meats and sausages. Check our Web Site out and see what our customer say about us and our product

Based on that I am more inclined to think they are using a grill flavor additive.

Unless you are a food scientist or a food/spice manufacturing company (or have a friend who is) it's unlikely you'll be able to get your hands on anything like those flavor additives.
I like animals, they taste good!

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Offline classicrockgriller

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #32 on: February 09, 2011, 09:47:18 am »
of the additives u have seen, which one do u think will work.

Offline BuyLowSellHigh

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #33 on: February 09, 2011, 11:59:01 am »
I've looked everywhere I can think of and I can't find any source of "grill flavor" in the retail market.  The only ones I can find are for food manufacturers, and the quantities tend to be on the order of 50 lbs.

Maybe JH could help you out, or someone in a similar position.
I like animals, they taste good!

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Offline Tenpoint5

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #34 on: February 09, 2011, 03:27:01 pm »
  i found this on line does it seem like what you got
GUN POWDER SEASONING
By Steve Elke

3 tablespoons Chili Powder
2 ½ tablespoons Paprika
2 tablespoons Salt
2 tablespoons Garlic Powder
1 tablespoon Ground Black Pepper
1 tablespoon Onion Powder
1 tablespoon Ground Cayenne Pepper
1 tablespoon Ground Chipotle Chili Pepper
1 tablespoon Ground Oregano
1 tablespoon Ground Thyme

i am trying to find a clone of it

OK I am working on a clone of this and have been in contact with BLSH to compare notes. As Eric is also working on a clone from a more scientific approach. Unlike my wet finger, stick in powder, stick on tongue approach. My clone comes just about as close in flavor as I think The average guy is going to be able to produce. My clone is more red than black but the flavor is pretty close. 10.5 1/4 said its good but it doesn't have the "Bang" that the original does. So there's hope for me I will be trying it on some hamburgers tonight to do a side by side cooking comparison.

I started with the basic recipe above and made adjustments from there in red.

GUN POWDER SEASONING
By Steve Elke

3 tablespoons Chili Powder
2 ½ tablespoons Paprika
2 tablespoons Salt
2 tablespoons Garlic Powder
1 tablespoon Ground Black Pepper
1 tablespoon Onion Powder
1/2 tablespoon Ground Cayenne Pepper
1 tablespoon Ground Chipotle Chili Pepper
1 tablespoon Ground Oregano
1 tablespoon Ground Thyme
2 tablespoon Wyler's Chicken bouillon granules (Grind to a powder with Spice Grinder or Mortar and Pestle)
2 tablespoon Celery Salt
3 tablespoon Accent Flavor Enhancer

Like I said this is pretty close with the wet finger test. I will report back after supper.
Bacon is the Crack Cocaine of the Food World.

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Offline KyNola

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #35 on: February 09, 2011, 04:25:46 pm »
10.5, you've been doing some work on this for sure.  Haven't used Accent in a long time.  Isn't that essentially MSG?  Just can't remember for sure.  Thanks for doing the lab work!

Offline Tenpoint5

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #36 on: February 09, 2011, 04:57:26 pm »
10.5, you've been doing some work on this for sure.  Haven't used Accent in a long time.  Isn't that essentially MSG?  Just can't remember for sure.  Thanks for doing the lab work!

Yep that's what it is!!

Now this evening I put my clone on the burgers I made for supper. Now since 10.5 1/4 said my clone didn't have the "Bang" that GP had. I pulled a fast one on her. She got the clone. She asked which one was on her burger. I LIED and told her it was GP (The Black One). I like this one better than the one you made Dad was the comment she made after tasting the burger. I had two burgers and dressed them exactly the same, Katsoup, Mustard, Pickle relish, Onion and American cheese. I couldn't tell the difference between the two burgers. So as far as I am concerned, This is a close enough clone for me.
Bacon is the Crack Cocaine of the Food World.

Be careful about calling yourself and EXPERT! An ex is a has-been, and a spurt is a drip under pressure!


Offline classicrockgriller

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #37 on: February 09, 2011, 05:16:33 pm »
Good job Chris.

Now clone the red stuff. ;D

Offline Tenpoint5

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #38 on: February 09, 2011, 05:26:42 pm »
Good job Chris.

Now clone the red stuff. ;D

Never tried the red stuff!! They probably order somebody else's rub in bulk and sell it as their own as well.
Bacon is the Crack Cocaine of the Food World.

Be careful about calling yourself and EXPERT! An ex is a has-been, and a spurt is a drip under pressure!


Offline OU812

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #39 on: February 09, 2011, 05:52:11 pm »
I kinda think it has some worcestershire powder in it too.

Offline BuyLowSellHigh

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #40 on: February 09, 2011, 06:05:40 pm »
Talked with Chris (Tenpoint5) and we compared notes.  I took a very different approach.  Mine is based upon the label ingredients and what I suspect is being used (grill flavor) based upon what little I know about some food service products.  Here is my feeble chemist's attempt to produce a clone.  It is very feeble as I don't have a reference by which to judge.  What I plan to do is send it to 10.5 and let his tasting panel evaluate this first trial.

The big challenge is to get grill flavor.  The very basic versions of that stuff are made by pyrolizing vegetable oil.  Since that isn't practical in the home (think controlled grease fire) I had to get creative. A common tool use in the spice blending trade is to add a vegetable oil to blends at the 1% level to prevent separation.  So I thought I could use that idea to coat a veg oil onto the salt, burn it in the oven and then use that salt to make a clone.

The drill is as follows - 250 g of Morton Kosher salt + 7.5 g (about 3 tsp) of Wesson Best Blend (canola + soybean) oil, blend it in a KA mixer on speed 2 for 3 minutes.  At that level, 3% oil) it is surface saturated as seen by traces of oil remaining on the bowl.

The coated salt was then placed in a saute pan and oven roasted at 500 - 550 °F in a convection oven for 3 hours.  That gave this as the salt.



A few pulses through a blade grinder and it looked like this



Flavor of the "roasted" salt is very mild grilled flavor.

Now to blending.  I like to target 2% salt to meat by weight.  For MSG I looked at Accent's recommendations, which amounts to 0.4%  (MSG) to meat by weight.  That gave me a ratio of 20% MSG to salt. The rest is looking at relative amounts to salt of flavor spices in other blends, like Montreal Steak Seasoning.  After all the head work, this is the blend mix I concocted:

Treated salt = 100 g
MSG (Accent) = 20 g
Granulated onion (Leggs) = 15 g
Granulated garlic (Leggs) = 10 g
Black Pepper , ground) = 8 g
Jalapeno powder = 6 g  (Thanks CRG! - didn't know it, but I was out)
Veg oil = 1.5 g (~ 1/2 tsp)

Put all the dry in a KA mixer with the paddle, speed 2 for about a minute, add the veg oil and continue on speed 2 for about 3 minutes.  Here is what you get



I would describe the taste as meaty/salty/lightly grilled.  I would like to have a more pronounced grill flavor.  Doing that the way I did would probably take a second trip of treating the salt and back through the oven, which is more than I am willing to give it at this point.

If Chris is up for it, I'll send it to him and let his professional taste panel give it a whirl.
I like animals, they taste good!

Visit the Recipe site here

Offline Tenpoint5

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #41 on: February 09, 2011, 07:33:46 pm »
Looks interesting Eric. Send it on up I will put it the testing panel and see what she says. I will let you know what the results are.
Bacon is the Crack Cocaine of the Food World.

Be careful about calling yourself and EXPERT! An ex is a has-been, and a spurt is a drip under pressure!


Offline KyNola

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #42 on: February 10, 2011, 07:18:20 am »
Awesome work guys!  Interesting to see the different yet closely the same results from two different guys with different backgrounds.

Thanks a lot Chris and Eric. 

Offline Tenpoint5

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #43 on: February 10, 2011, 08:04:31 am »
Eric Translate this into English for Me, would you Please!!!

Aroma components of an oil-based grill flavoring by direct thermal desorption-gas chromatography-olfactometry and sample dilution analysis.

Webb TE, Cadwallader KR.

Department of Food Science and Technology, Mississippi Agricultural Experiment Station, Mississippi State University, USA.
Abstract

Grill flavorings are a convenient way for food processors to impart grill-like flavor to meat products that have not been grilled. In this study a commercially available oil-based processed grill flavoring was analyzed by direct thermal desorption (DTD)-gas chromatography-olfactometry (GCO) and DTD-GC-mass spectrometry (MS). Sample mass dilution analysis-GCO was used to indicate which compounds had the greatest impact on the overall aroma of the sample. Major aroma contributors included 1-octen-3-one, 2-methoxyphenol, and (E)-2-nonenal. Minor contributors were (E)-2-decenal and 2,4-decadienal. Other major contributors, characterized as having grill aroma notes, were unidentified. Excluding the possibility of artifact formation from the thermal degradation of fatty acid hydroperoxides, DTD functioned well as a GCO technique, but poorly as a qualitative GC-MS technique.

PMID: 11548153 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
« Last Edit: February 10, 2011, 09:31:19 am by Tenpoint5 »
Bacon is the Crack Cocaine of the Food World.

Be careful about calling yourself and EXPERT! An ex is a has-been, and a spurt is a drip under pressure!


Offline classicrockgriller

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Re: Gun Powder Seasoning
« Reply #44 on: February 10, 2011, 08:05:47 am »
That is some great work Eric.

If the "charred seasoning" can be figured out, I will

talk to JH about the chances of him ordering some.

He may be interested in some himself.

Wish I had known you didn't have some, would have

brought you a sample of both kinds.

It (GP) looks like pic #2.