Author Topic: Heat recovery  (Read 5351 times)

Offline werwin

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Heat recovery
« on: September 11, 2015, 09:23:55 am »
 Hi All
 Have a question and did as much research on here as i could but i never really found an answer.
 I preheat hour 2 at most get temp up to 220 no prob.  boil water to put in catch bowl have a brick in the bottom to help with heat let meat get to room temp.  keep the vent at 1/4 or 1/2  75 85 degs outside temp put the meat in (country ribs maybe 12 total)  heat drops cause of door being open  it just will not recover the heat 2-3 hours into it 150 175 at very most.
 What can i do to help the heat recover? i feel that i'm not getting a good cooking because of this i tried the 321 method and the meat was really starting to dry i believe because the temp was so low it was drying the meat more then cooking.
 Any suggestions  or  ideas what to do?
 Thanks
 Tony

Offline tskeeter

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2015, 11:20:45 am »
Tony, I think the problem you are having is that the instructions for the 3-2-1 method of preparing ribs is for a rack of spareribs or St. Louis style spareribs, not for the country style ribs you have used.  The country style ribs are much meatier and have much less connective tissue to break down than spareribs.  As a result, I suspect that your country style ribs are not getting cooked properly.

I tend to think of country style ribs as being more like a slab off a bone-in roast than I do spareribs or back ribs.  Since it is more like a bone-in steak than a rack of ribs, I wonder if you wouldn't have better luck preparing more similarly to the way you'd do a steak.

Not knowing how much weight your 12 country style ribs translates into, I suspect that the slow heat recovery you experienced could be related to having a large volume of meat in the smoker.  If your ribs were about a pound each, you had the equivalent of a 12 pound roast in the smoker. 
« Last Edit: September 11, 2015, 11:29:04 am by tskeeter »

Offline Jim O

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2015, 12:45:38 pm »
You may also try opening up your vent more. Mine is always wide open, as I removed the shutter to put on an 90 deg elbow,to vent out a window. After that I found the heat recovered faster.
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Offline Habanero Smoker

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2015, 01:18:56 pm »
In this case I would recommend a wider vent opening. When you pour boiling water into the bowl, you are releasing a lot of steam inside that cabinet. Do you know if there was any condensation inside the cabinet? If there is condensation, that will bring your temperature down. Where you using the door thermometer to measure the cabinet temperature? If it was the cabinet thermometer, once food is place in the cabinet, it is not reliable gauge.


These days the term country style ribs could mean a lot of different thing to the store that is selling them. I've rarely seen actual country style ribs that are cut from the rib end of the loin that attaches to the shoulder. They should be cooked like baby backs. I will often see the shoulder sliced up, or even the sirloin end, or center cut of the loin sliced up and sold as country style ribs. Depending or where it was cut from, and whether they were actual country style ribs, it will require a different cooking methods. Did you notice what cut the country ribs were cut from. It will state it on the label. If they were from the sirloin end, and packaged as country style ribs, six hours is way too long.




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Offline cathouse willy

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2015, 01:59:15 pm »
There are several other ways to improve the recovery time,keep the smoker out of the wind,wrap it in a hot water tank insulation blanket and build or buy a cabinet for the smoker to live in. I tried an experiment today with my heat gun. After opening the door to probe the meat I put the gun part way into the  bottom of the cabinet and closed the door as much as possible. the cab temp had dropped to180f from 225f, I was able to get it back up to 225 in just 2 or 3 minutes with the heat gun on high. Be careful you don't point it at the food, heat guns get way hotter than a hair dryer

Offline werwin

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2015, 02:25:31 pm »
tskeeter yes these were pretty thick if i were to guess now at least 1 1/4 to 1 1/2  with bone in the weight was 10 pounds of meat total  you think this is normal for a large roast also?
 Jim O i guess i'm looking at it the wrong way i figured with the vent closed more less heat loss through the vent.
 Habanero Smoker no i did not notice any condensation when i rotated the racks i was using door  and a digital iGrill thermometer but they did stay close to the same  the meat got as high as the cab temp but i still finished in oven   no label they were from a local butcher shop i believe i have pictures at home will post when i get there.
 cathouse willy there was very little wind that day i it was 70 out when started and over 90 till i took them out i would love to build something to keep it in but was hoping to keep it mobile so i could use it on the deck in the summer and move it under  the deck in the winter to keep it out of the weather  i may have to try the heat gun i have one that works well.
 Thank you all for your advice it helps alot  i was just wondering if i should be adding a second heating element
 

Offline Habanero Smoker

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2015, 02:18:16 am »
If they were bone-in country ribs, they were probably true country ribs, but they still could have been cut from the shoulder with the blade bone attached. If they are true country ribs they may have been overcooked. They should be cooked like baby backs; maybe a little longer cook time.

As for the temperature, where were the probes placed in relation to the meat. Was the probe between the racks? If so that will give you a lower reading than the temperature that the bottom rack is being exposed to. If you were measuring on the bottom rack, was the probe at least 2-inches from the meat? If the probe is too close to the meat, it may register a lower temperature, and/or if meat juices are dripping on the probe that can cause a lower reading.

As for the vent settings, there are different opinions on that. Some say to keep it fully open at all times. Moisture in the cabinet will keep your cabinet temperature down. While others say to keep it open enough to allow enough moisture to escape, to prevent condensation; the condensation causes the loss in temperature, and if the vent is opened too much it may cause heat loss. It is something that you should experiment with, when you are using a stock Bradley. A good starting point would be 1/2 to 3/4 open, and adjust from there. Chicken with skin gives off a lot of moisture, so you may want to use a wider opening for that. I explained it more in detail in the link below.
http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=36706.msg418589#msg418589



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beefmann

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2015, 06:11:56 am »
i see two  problems...

first .. Always run your smoker with the top  vent wide  open, this helps with  circulation and heat recovery

two, 12 or  so  country ribs can and are a  large  quantity  of  meat which is  now a  heat  load pulling out a  lot of  heat  from the  smoker...

i have seen  heat drops  with as  little  as 4 to 5  lbs of meat,,,

another  note is  once the  smoker is  loaded never  open the   door to  check on the meat,, also you can  leave the  smoke generator  on  for additional heat

Offline werwin

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2015, 06:49:22 am »
trying to load some pictures but photobucket is having some issues   anyway Habanero Smoker to be honest i have no idea where the prob was in relation to the meat anymore but this brings up another question  where or does it matter where the temp is taken? bottom, middle or top of smoker? also when taking meat temp what rack is it best to check again bottom? middle or top?
 Correct me if i am wrong but if i don't need all 4 racks i keep my food away from the bottom like the ribs got them all on 3 racks so i used the top 3 this sound right?
 but when cooking my main goal was internal temp of the meat maybe that was my issue. it just seemed that at 150 170 it took forever to get the meat temp to 150 160.
  beefmann  i ordered 10lbs so i am guessing that what the 12 weighted hoping my butcher is honest i did not reweigh them. Is that to much? the only time i opened it was about 2 hours in i rotated racks front to back and top to bottom other then that i just watched the temps from the outside.
 This is all new to me i really don't know the limitations of theses smokers guess it's a live and learn thing.
 I do understand that the heat isn't going to regain right away room temp or not i just induced 10lbs of cold into the smoker i just thought i should come back to a 200 deg temp at some point .
 I would like to that everyone for their links and suggestions i am learing as i go and just hope i'm not beating anyone up with the simple questions
 Thank you

Offline KyNola

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2015, 07:09:50 am »
By chance is your Bradley plugged into a long extension cord or an outlet that is on the same circuit with another power consuming appliance?  If either or both is true that can have an effect on Bradley's performance and heat recovery. The reason I ask is I noticed you said you preheated for and hour, maybe 2 to get to a tower temp of 220.  Under optimal performance it shouldn't take an hour to bring an empty Bradley to 220.

Offline manfromplaid

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2015, 07:11:46 am »
keep asking questions  we all had to learn and the folks on this site are happy to share.  the bradley does have different heat areas but if you rotate the rack front to back top to bottom you will get a more even cook.your heat recovery can be a little slow and its worse if the door is opened. as said: the meat sucks up a lot of heat and its very easy to see because when just getting started we tend to watch the temps. its normal just give it time and it gets hotter. low and slow  means plan ahead and give yourself extra time. meat cooks at the speed the meat cooks some faster some slower. a good remote meat thermometer will help. its a process and you will get it. 

Offline werwin

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2015, 10:20:39 am »
 KyNola yes it was on a extension cord but it is a heavy duty 12/3 cord not 100% sure if anything else is on that line not sure if the outside outlets are tied into any of the inside ones.  but  what i meant was it got up to temp pretty quick i left it preheat while the meat sat out i didn't want you to think i turned it on and put the meat in and expected it to be at temp. i left it heat and stabilize before hand.
 manfromplaid thank you  you guys and gals are great i do want to get a 3rd probe so i can see bottom top and cabin temp just to see how different they run. yes you are correct i watch that temp a lot i recently went back to a charcoal grill and left the gas grill behind had to relearn grilling all over again lol and as you said think a head. but on the other  hand gas or charcoal the recovery time is fast and i guess that's what i'm expecting need to get that out of my head
thanks again

Offline Habanero Smoker

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #12 on: September 12, 2015, 01:18:57 pm »
When I started with the Bradley I also constantly monitored the temperatures in various zones until I got use to it, and determined that the bottom zone was best for my cooking style. I do the same with any new outdoor cooking equipment I get.

The internal temperature is one of the best sources to go by, but I also use a bamboo skewer to test for doness. When the skewer slide in with very little resistance, it is bite of the bone tender.. I didn't catch the internal temperature until you latest post. I was addressing the use of the 3-2-1 method for the country ribs, the dryness of the meat, and low temperature where your probe was located.
 
Like most cooking devices, there are different temperature zones. I rotate my racks, so I like to place my probe at the bottom rack, where the meat at the bottom is receiving the greatest amount of heat. If you place the probe in between trays of meat, the evaporation of moisture from the meat, will lower the temperature, and your probe will read lower. Some articles report that evaporation from meat, can lower the surrounding air temperature by as much as 40°F, at the beginning of a cook.

When I mention bottom rack, what I'm referring to is the bottom tray of meat, whether it be on the first rail from the top or the second rail etc. When I use less then four racks of food, I will always leave the bottom rail empty, and clip my probe onto the fourth rail (my probe has an alligator clip). If I only have one rack of food, I will use the third rail from the top, and with two racks I use the second, and third rails from the top, but I will always clip my probe onto the bottom rail, more than halfway to the door.

As for the country ribs. One way to tell if you have country ribs, is that the bone should have a roundest shape to, and not so flat as a baby back or flat like the shoulder blade.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2015, 01:23:14 pm by Habanero Smoker »


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Offline tskeeter

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2015, 10:46:45 am »
KyNola yes it was on a extension cord but it is a heavy duty 12/3 cord not 100% sure if anything else is on that line not sure if the outside outlets are tied into any of the inside ones.  but  what i meant was it got up to temp pretty quick i left it preheat while the meat sat out i didn't want you to think i turned it on and put the meat in and expected it to be at temp. i left it heat and stabilize before hand.
 manfromplaid thank you  you guys and gals are great i do want to get a 3rd probe so i can see bottom top and cabin temp just to see how different they run. yes you are correct i watch that temp a lot i recently went back to a charcoal grill and left the gas grill behind had to relearn grilling all over again lol and as you said think a head. but on the other  hand gas or charcoal the recovery time is fast and i guess that's what i'm expecting need to get that out of my head
thanks again


Tony, in our 2006 home, the service comes in on the south side of the house, from there, the power for the 15 amp exterior outlet on the west side of the house runs to a GFI in the garage on the northeast corner of the house, then to the outlet in the center of the south side of the house.  The same circuit may also serve the exterior outlet on the north side of the house and the outlet in the shop.  I suspect it's pretty common for the exterior outlets and garage outlets in newer homes to be on the same circuit, since all are protected by GFI's and a single GFI can be used to protect several outlets.  So, if a person has a refrigerator or freezer in their garage, there could be a pretty significant power draw on the same circuit.

In our 1990 house, the exterior outlet on the patio was protected by a GFI in the kitchen.  So, it would have been possible to have a coffee pot or a toaster oven on the circuit that would be used to power a smoker. 

Offline werwin

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Re: Heat recovery
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2015, 07:07:51 am »
tskeeter i will have to do some research on that because my house was built in 2005 and i made sure i had a bunch of outlet in the garage (16 in a 28X28 garage) and 7 outside outlets around garage and deck and depending on what circuit they are on there is a frige and freezer on one circuit. But i know i have at least 2 GFI's in the garage  but i will have to look into this closer and see what i can do.
 But on the other hand when preheating it , it came right up to temp it was after the meat was in was my heating issue