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Author Topic: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod  (Read 34391 times)

Offline ghosttown

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #45 on: January 02, 2016, 06:12:43 pm »
Orion, did you find the fan at that location helps? Reason for asking people have been putting then just right above the v-trap (drip tray). Just looking for a fan now so I can install one.

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Offline Orion

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #46 on: January 05, 2016, 11:36:11 am »
Yes, locating the fan as described in this thread works well.

First thing I noticed with the fan is that the stock temperature probe reading increased. With the cabinet temperature stable (as stable as it gets) at 160 I turned the fan on and the temp reading rose quickly to 180. This tells me that the heat in the smoker can be isolated in pockets below the drip tray and the fan moves the air around to create a more even temp throughout the cabinet.

My sausage products also go through the initial warm and dry cycle much faster and more evenly. I find I turn my racks less frequently with the fan installed where it is. 
It's going to take a lifetime to smoke all this.

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Offline cycleguy55

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #47 on: January 30, 2016, 01:58:00 pm »
Well, three mods down, two to go. Got my second element installed using a new and simple means of attaching it... 3 clamps, 3 standoffs and a little hardware.

The clamp on each end of 2nd element is a loose fit to allow expansion of ceramics and the inner clamp is snug to secure element.

Cabinet went from 65' F to 250'f in 10 minutes.

My inclination would be to use  two end clamps as you did, but tighten only one of them, leaving the other loose as a support that would let the element slide as it expanded and contracted.  Did you consider this method?  Your thoughts on this?

Offline Orion

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #48 on: January 30, 2016, 03:23:02 pm »
If you examine the installation of the original element you will see that it is supported on each end within the ceramic blocks. These two support points are a slip fit. This insulates the element to reduce heat transfer and allows for the ceramic ends of the element to expand under heat. The third attach point fir the original element is a snug fit band clamp that locates the element securely and prevents it from shifting left or right.

My installation of the second element duplicates that principle. The two clamps on the ends of the second element  have an inside diameter that when tight, allows for expansion of the ceramic ends of the element. If the slip fit did not exist, there is a likelihood that the ceramic end could crack. There should be some allowance for expansion.

It's a red hot piece of metal with 120 VAC running through it so the third clamp; metal to metal, ensures it wont shift left or right. I have found the installation works well and when the time comes, replacement will be easy.
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Offline Orion

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #49 on: January 30, 2016, 03:26:07 pm »
Just to clarify, the element ceramic ends will expand radially as well as longitudinally.
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Offline fremontfrank1

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #50 on: February 18, 2016, 11:33:53 pm »
thank you Orion,
Newbie here to brads. But old man to creo problems. Was wondering about my puck burns. Like mod, makes great since, should also help on any bitter smoke because of complete burns. And not letting next puck not burning when not needed. even though I will still be trying blanks at end time. Also using lasagna dispo pan for water bath, more mass for heat and drince bath. Other than heat up grade mod, will work this into mine to. Sorry physics wins out on element clamps, the way you did it is right on. metal expanse longitudinal and circumferential. Since the one metal clamp in middle is cheap metal clamp it to will expand with element and not interfere with heating.     

Offline Edward176

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #51 on: March 16, 2016, 09:09:30 pm »
Quick question for you Orion, did you just run a new wire from the existing element lug to the new element lug? Or was there some additional wiring involved, can't really tell by the photos. But I too live in Canada (Winnipeg) and know all about shutting down for 4+ months of the year. Can't decide on whether to do the second 500 watt mod or go to the 725 Watt element?

Offline TedEbear

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #52 on: March 17, 2016, 04:18:11 am »
Quick question for you Orion, did you just run a new wire from the existing element lug to the new element lug?

That's how I did mine, just a short 3-4 inch loop of wire on each end from the original element to the new one.  Mine has been that way for 3-4 years. I also added a PID controller at the same time because they say the factory controller is not designed to handle the higher wattage.

Offline Orion

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #53 on: March 17, 2016, 05:55:45 am »
Quick question for you Orion, did you just run a new wire from the existing element lug to the new element lug? Or was there some additional wiring involved, can't really tell by the photos. But I too live in Canada (Winnipeg) and know all about shutting down for 4+ months of the year. Can't decide on whether to do the second 500 watt mod or go to the 725 Watt element?

I wired mine a little differently from what you have described however your method would work fine as TedEBear confirms.

I removed the smokers back panel to expose the terminal connections and wires powering the original element. I then cut the spade connectors off the original element wires and crimped two new ones on the original  wires along with a new wire on each connector to feed the second element. This enabled me to put a fuse in the back panel area for ther second element.

In short... the elements are run in parallel right from the spade connectors at the back panel and each element is fused independently.

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Offline Edward176

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #54 on: March 17, 2016, 11:13:37 am »
Quick question for you Orion, did you just run a new wire from the existing element lug to the new element lug?

That's how I did mine, just a short 3-4 inch loop of wire on each end from the original element to the new one.  Mine has been that way for 3-4 years. I also added a PID controller at the same time because they say the factory controller is not designed to handle the higher wattage.

There lies the issue that seems to be overlooked, the Smoke Generator may OR may not be capable to handle the addition of 500 Watts on it. That being said if someone does this mod, or the 725 Element mod, and doesn't get a PID then there may be damage to the circuitry of the Controller. Either way the mod becomes an expensive upgrade either with a PID or risking frying your Smoke Generator. Now I have a lot to think of and take under consideration. Thank You TedEbear and Orion 

Offline ghosttown

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #55 on: March 18, 2016, 07:26:20 am »
Orion: Did you end up installing the light?

Offline wurzel

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #56 on: July 15, 2016, 04:26:11 pm »
This forum is a godsend for the electrically illiterate like me, thanks to all of you for sharing. On to my (illiterate) question;

If you wire it element to element as TedEbear did and use a PID controller would that remove the rational for a second fuse or would it still be safer to wire them in parallel with separate fuses?

Cheers.
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Offline Habanero Smoker

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #57 on: July 16, 2016, 01:30:29 am »
Those that add the second inline fuse, and temp sensor, do so as an extra precaution. I didn't add them when I added the additional element.


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Offline wurzel

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #58 on: July 18, 2016, 08:47:18 am »
Ok, one more question and I promise to just get on with it and do it ;)

If you're not adding the inline fuse and temp sensor is there any advantage to wiring it in parallel rather than hooking the new element up to the old one as TedEBear did?

It seems to me that this route would mean the new element is protected by the existing in-line first, the same as the old one. I'd assume that's not a good as a dedicated fuse for each but better than nothing... I'm useless at electrics though so happy to be corrected. Looks a lot simpler to do too of course :D

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Offline Habanero Smoker

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Re: 2nd Element, Fan and Burner Mod
« Reply #59 on: July 18, 2016, 01:15:08 pm »
I haven't wired mine that way, but those that have haven't posted any problems with the fuse and sensor blowing.


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                   inhale.
  ::)