I was hoping someone could give me some advice with snack sticks. I recently purchased the Bradley 4 rack digital smoker. I also purchased the HMS snack in sticks jalapeno Blend. It comes with the casings, seasoning, and cure. From reading the forums it sounded pretty straight forward.
Eventually I want to work my way up to venison, but decided to start with beef as it is more readily available. I used 5 lbs of 80% lean beef. Mixed in the cure and season along with the ice water 1/4 cup per lb per the instructions. I refrigerated the snack sticks over night.
The next morning I put the snack sticks in the smoker. From here I used NePas directions. Pre heat smoker to 130. I did not hang the sticks. I laid them flat on the racks(I will hang them next time). Bumped the heat to 150 and turned smoke on for 2 hours. Turned smoke off and bumped the heat 10 degrees every hour till my internal temperature was 152 degree. The cooking time was 9 hours. A friend said that is too long for snack sticks, but he failed to offer any direct advice on improving my process.
The meat appeared done, but it tasted horrible. It tasted like they were over smoked. After 2 bites, those who ate them felt sick to there stomach. The smokiness of the meat was overpowering.
I have recently purchased a PID, hooks, and another thermometer. I would love to make another attempt at this over Christmas weekend and try to redeem myself.
Any advice would be much appreciated.
Did you have your damper open?
Mike
For the first two to three hours i had it half open. After the smoking was done I closed it to 1/4 way open to try and get the temperature up.
I would suggest dropping your smoke time down to 1 hour or 1:20. As for the vent you should probably leave it 3/4's of the way open. Was there any black spots on the sticks? I would venture to guess with the 80% burger and the vent settings you used, you got a bit of Black Rain on your sticks. That would cause some of the reactions you have been describing. It is caused by the retention of moisture inside the cabinet.
I did not notice any black spots. The meat actually looked real good. Comparable to alot of the pictures i have seen on this site.
I am going to do a smaller batch(1-2 lbs this weekend), use a PID, add cheese, and hang the meat. I will also try to drop my smoke time down to 1 hour. In regards to cook time, is 9 hours about right? seems long to me. A friend has a gas smoker and said he cooks 3 lbs sticks for only 5 hours.
Do you suggest a different mix of meat than 80%?
I just did 5 lbs of sticks on the weekend and they took 10hrs, suprised me how long they took but didn't rush them. My highest temp setting was 170. Just leave the damper wide open IMO, plus 2hrs of smoke isn't all that long. Did they sit over night? I took mine out of the smoker and had one about 1 hr after, wow very smokey (ash tray). Vac packed the rest, had some yesterday, awesome, tasted great.
If they didn't sit for 24hrs, try another batch, let them rest over night. The smoke always tames down and they start tasting great.
I did both. . . I tried some an hour after and they were really bad. I put them in the fridge for 2 days. Tried them again. They were still too smokey for my taste. Ashy is exactly how i would describe the taste.
9 Hours for 5 pounds is about right. I stuff mine in casings and they are usually in the 8-9 hour time frame. I like using the 85/15 if I am not doing venison.
You wont be able to compare smoking your sticks with basically a 500watt light bulb to a gas burner. The best advise I can give you is this. Relax and enjoy the ride. This is Low and Slow. Also keep the vent open 3/4 to full. After the smoke time has finished pull the spent pucks and change the water with new boiling water. That should cut down on the ashy taste as well
Wait until you cure and smoke a ham from start to finish and have a 36 hour smoke time!
What kind of wood did you use? Maybe try a lighter wood. Try apple or alder. I like hickory but its a stronger wood.
I like 1-1/2 to 2 hours of smoke but some people do not like that much. Try an hour.
KEEP THE VENT OPEN! Closing it does not help getting the temp up. It only traps smoke and condensation.
I always rack my sticks, its easier for me to rotate them for a more even cook. I rotate top to bottom, front to back every 1-1/2 hours or so.
When using beef I like 85/15 but 80/20 should be ok.
I do not go above 170 F for sticks or sausage.
I empty the water bowl when done smoking but only put a little bit back in to catch any grease, you should not have any grease if the temp is right.
Hope this helps.
I used Hickory pucks. I think I will try cutting the smoke time down on this next batch and see where that gets me. I will try a lighter wood this go around.
It sounds like I closed the vent more than I should so I will keep it open this time.
I did rotate exactly like you described.
I emptied the water bowl after the smoke was done. I read this helps keep the moisture out.
I appreciate all the advice. I will give it another shot this weekend. I will keep you posted. If any other suggestions please keep them coming.
BigRed, welcome to the forum. I read where you said that you used 1/4 cup of water per 1 pounds. That 2.5 cups of water! When I do stixs I only use 1/2 cup per 5 pounds. Even if a store bought mix calls for that much water I personally would only use 1/2 cup. The moisture will add time to your smoke. I use 2 hrs of Hickory on all my snack stixs and never got the ash tray taste. I did a 5 pound batch last night and they were great and got another 5 pound batch in smoking now with 2 hrs of Hickory. As Pens said you can use a milder wood and see it that is more to your liking. Good luck with your smoking and remember that we are here to help you.
Thank you for the hospitality. Everyone here appears to be really helpful. This is my first thread I have started, but been looking at the forum for about a month now.
The directions called for 1/4 cup per 1 lb of meat. I added a total of 1 and 1/2 cups of water for the 5lb of meat. After adding the cure, seasoning and water to the meat it was pretty thick, but stuffed ok in the casings. I only had 1 casing break. Thoughts?
BigRed
I'm thinking the ashy taste was caused by lack of ventilation. I smoke a lot of sausage and I apply 3 hours of hickory to it on a regular basis. Having said that though, everyone has there own personal level of smoke flavor they prefer and you are better off going light than over doing it until you find that sweet spot.
You want the smoke to gently roll by the meat and gently kiss it. When you close down the vent too much you are trapping the smoke and moisture in the cabinet and it will adhere to the meat and give it that ashy taste.
Also, as you slowly raise the temp in the smoker don't go over 170 degrees as you will start to render the fat out of the sausage.
...And above all else... Fire another batch in! You'll have it mastered in no time! ;)
Mike
Thanks Mike.
Is it safe to pre-heat at 130 for 1 hour. Bump heat to 150 when I put the sausage in and start smoking. when i have finished smoking bump the heat 10 degrees mabye every two hours until I max out at 170?
Quote from: BigRed41 on December 21, 2011, 10:44:34 AM
Thanks Mike.
Is it safe to pre-heat at 130 for 1 hour. Bump heat to 150 when I put the sausage in and start smoking. when i have finished smoking bump the heat 10 degrees mabye every two hours until I max out at 170?
No
You want the smoker warmed up to 130 and then put your sausage in for an hr for the casings to dry before you start the smoke.
ah ok. Makes sense.
I hope everyone had a Merry Christmas.
Over the holiday I tried another batch of snack sticks. They were at least edible this time around. I think i made major improvements over the first batch i made, thanks to all the help on this forum.
The two problems I had is half the meat had small black spots on it. It also appeared the meat was a little greasy for my liking. I used 81/19 beef(1.75 lbs) with 0.25 of pork. I used about 15% high temp Cheddar cheese( i think it was about 4 oz). Are the black spots OK to eat?
I preheated at 130. cooked for 1 hour at 150(no water in bowl up to this point). Smoked for 100 minutes at 150(added water to the bowl for the pucks, but removed promptly when the smoke shut off). Then raised temp to 170 till internal temperature was 152. Took about 5 and 1/2 hours. I only cooked 2 lbs of meat. Vent was all the way open the entire time.
Suggestions on how I can improve with the black spots and extra grease?
Quote from: BigRed41 on December 29, 2011, 02:17:53 PM
I hope everyone had a Merry Christmas.
Over the holiday I tried another batch of snack sticks. They were at least edible this time around. I think i made major improvements over the first batch i made, thanks to all the help on this forum.
The two problems I had is half the meat had small black spots on it. It also appeared the meat was a little greasy for my liking. I used 81/19 beef(1.75 lbs) with 0.25 of pork. I used about 15% high temp Cheddar cheese( i think it was about 4 oz). Are the black spots OK to eat?
I preheated at 130. cooked for 1 hour at 150(no water in bowl up to this point). Smoked for 100 minutes at 150(added water to the bowl for the pucks, but removed promptly when the smoke shut off). Then raised temp to 170 till internal temperature was 152. Took about 5 and 1/2 hours. I only cooked 2 lbs of meat. Vent was all the way open the entire time.
Suggestions on how I can improve with the black spots and extra grease?
Black spots are called black rain which is to much moisture in the smoker causing it to build up and drop back onto the meat, also having your vent closed off to much, my vent is full open all the time.
I had the vent open all the way the entire time. Could the pork in addition to the 81% beef been too much fat causing more moisture?
Quote from: BigRed41 on December 29, 2011, 04:07:21 PM
I had the vent open all the way the entire time. Could the pork in addition to the 81% beef been too much fat causing more moisture?
It's possible. When you are working with small numbers (2 lbs) it doesn't take much to change the ratio. The one thing you didn't mention was what the lean/fat ratio was in the pork. As an example, if the .25 lb of pork was mostly pork fat your final mix could have been around 70/30. I prefer my snack sticks a little leaner than my regular sausage. For me I prefer a final mix around 85/15 for snack sticks. For regular sausage I use around 80/20 to 85/15.
Mike
I followed this thread closely, followed everything that was said here and made 5lbs of NePaS snack stiks myself last weekend. Total time for me was @9 1/2 hours. I did a plain 80/20 ratio and they came out good. Vent was wide open the entire time as well.
I'll post a thread about it tonight or tomorrow from my home computer.