Hello everyone, Been watching in the shadows for awhile now. I have tried a few different items in my bradley and they have turned out ok. I tried about 12lbs of spare ribs from sams club. I smoked in 2 shifts, half and half one with oak and one with hickory. I used a rub from the forum - let them sit in the refer over night in ziplocks. I set the smoker @ 195 and smoked for @ 4 hrs w/ bacon on the top shelf. I wrapped them in foil and moved them into the oven @ 205 for an additional 4 hrs. They came out ok but there was a lot of fat inside the meat that really turned everyone off. I really poured the rub on (because the last time I was fairly skimpy on it) this time but there was just a hint of seasoning when we ate them. I had the vent mostly open and worry about the outside getting dry if I don't wrap and move to the oven. I tried a brisket a few weeks back using the same methods and had basically the same results. The taste was ok, the smoke was good but the fat is an issue - I think there is more in the Fargo dump than what we ate. I was devoted to these ribs this time. With the floods I had a generator on standby for the sump pumps and one for the smoker. Luckly the power didn't go out this time. Any thoughts out there or Ideas on what I should try? Will I have better luck with a different cut of meat? I have made it through the grill to the brinkman all in one to the bradley, so I have had a fair amount of practice on ribs. I haven't tried smoking anything else except the ribs, jerky and the one brisket. I have a few phesants from last fall in the freezer right next to the northerns that I would like to try eventually.
Ok mr. ND .Your problem is not the the sams club ribs its the time.First of all i use sams clubs meat and let me tell you there great for the money.Second of all the spare ribs they sell are great but your times are way off.I do sams clubs baby back ribs not spare ribs which take longer only 7 eight pounds of baby back ribs at the mosts at 195-200 for 4 -5 hours with the bacon deal on top.Your putting to much meat on at one time for this quick smoke remember low and slow..Any one else want to chime in. Great sams club meat give it more time even if ya gota taste test no one will know LOL.Ya need more time at a lower temp trust me i have these sam club ribs down to a tee.Next time try the baby back better cut my friend.Let me know how all turns out.O yea use the emril rib rub on those baby backs.Fantastic just do a pull test to see where your at.If it takes longer dont worry you wil figure it out .
nd...
you need to look at this link....
http://forum.bradleysmoker.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1140
it talks about internal temps and connective tissue...
low and slow to desired internal... with spares and briskets its 190 internal for me... the link above explains it all in great detail...
you gotta eat...
owrstrich
ND Smoker,
To bad about the water problems. What a pain! We had to fight the same thing two summers ago at my in laws house while they were on vacation in Norway. I just had a hunch to send my wife over to check their house. Probably good that they were gone so we could make the decisions to "get er done".
I think you are doing a wonderful job. You really seem to know what to do. A word about spare ribs, first of all, they are not the choice cut of ribs. There is a lot more bone involved with the spare ribs and I don't care where you buy it, but the quality will vary from one batch to the next. Fat amounts and size amounts will vary. I would recommend the baby backs also.(Don't forget to remove the membrane from the underside.)
As far as the brisket, here again, they are variable in quality. They will contain a certain amount of fat. Look them over closely before purchasing.
Here is my suggestion, pick up some boneless chicken breast, season a few and marinade a few. Maybe try a new rub or tweak what you are using. Another item low in fat, boneless pork loin. Here again with the pork loin, you could cut the loin in half and use two seasonings/marinades to work out your favorites. Keep us posted on your next smoke.
In addition to what jaeger has already stated, if you get your brisket for Sam's you are getting an untrimmed cut of meat. I always trim the fat of my briskets to about 1/4 inch thick, and cut off any hard fat. I've done a few briskets, and I don't have a problem with them drying out. I take them out of the smoker at 180F.
I can't help you with the ribs. I don't do many of those.
I tested the link that owrstrich and I got a blank page. This may be the link he is refering to http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=72.0
Baby got back ribs are the way to go. If the ribs are bought at sams club. Like they said de membrane them.Rub them down and wrap them in plastic wrap 15-24 HOURS is ok or just the day before you do them NO ZIP LOCK BAGS .Take them out of the fridge let them get to room temp.Get the bs going to temps 190-200 no higher.Put the ribs in WITH THE biggest cuts on the bottom and the smaller cuts on top.Leave the top shelf empty for now.The vent on top is half way open at all times no biggie.After 2 hours rotate the racks and mop with sweet baby rays bbq sauce.In the thrid hour place the bacon on top then let it go for the remaining time 7-8 pounds of sams baby back ribs take 4-5 hours .Then take them out and do the ftc deal for about an hour or so.This is the way ive done them and they are too die for all the people ive givin them too also say the same.So try this hope it helps ;)
I trim my spares down to St Louis style most time ;D. Its easy to do and then I use the leftovers from the trimming as the top shelf stuff instead of the bacon. Pull off the membrane stuff best you can as this helps the ribs absorb the smoke better. I would try some with just some S&P, garlic powder and maybe some paprika for a little color and work up from there with the rub. I don't normally refigerate mine over night with the rub or anything lately cause I just haven't had time. No big difference in taste so far. Just really have to cook them to render out that fat nice and slow. Keep at it you will get them the way you like em. My spares usually go 8-9 hours or more. HTH Enjoy ;D.
How many pounds are you doing with those times .Big smoker.
Quote from: icerat4 on April 13, 2006, 12:25:46 PM
How many pounds are you doing with those times .Big smoker.
2 full racks how ever much that weighs ;D. If I do baby backs they usually take 5-6 hours. I like to keep the temps ways down round 215f. If you want them to be done faster 235-250 will work fine too IMO
No thanks on that higher temp deal.I am in no rush. More time to enjoy the hot tub and the weiss beer with a lemon twist ;) Let the meat do what they say its going to do. What do they say render and get the fibers moist deal .Yea thats it i love the low and slow deal ROOM for lots of error.LOL ;D.But i do agree with Bigsmoker completly very well said sir. ;D
Thanks for the info guys. After looking at the link posted I think my problem both with the brisket and the ribs is that after the 4 hrs of smoke I wrapped in foil and cooked in the oven. Probably not getting the dry environment needed with them wrapped.
Icerat - I am a little confused with the time thing. I smoked each 6 lb set for 4 hrs each. I ran 2 shifts so the most meat I had in it at one time was @ the 6 lbs plus the bacon on the top shelf. I didn't check the temp of the meat a all. After 8 hrs of cook time, 4 in the BS and 4 in the oven they were so tender that I couldn't even pick them up in one piece. They just fell apart. Had to dump them off the foil. I will have to leave in the smoker longer. I set my smoker at 195, I have the controller from allied kenco and works very well in keeping temp under control. I do notice that after initial warm up it takes a long time to come up to a pit temp of 195. I didn't realize they had different cuts of ribs at Sams. Going to have to go back and try the loin like jager mentioned. You say they have baby backs? What is the emril rub? Where do you get the sweet baby rays sauce? Think I might have to try something different over Easter. I haven't even started my research on birds yet. They scare me a little - don't want to get anyone sick. I did buy a big bag of boneless breasts a few weeks ago from sams and may have to give those a try also. I haven't really tried the ftc deal but I did use the apple juice. I have a bunch of coolers that schwans delivers their food in if you order off the internet or aren't home when they stop by. Might have to try using them instead of saving for fish we never catch.
I guess its a learning process - I did learn one thing the last time. Note to self. you need a bigger glove to pick the bubba puck off the generator element.
Quote from: jaeger on April 12, 2006, 09:23:57 PM
Another item low in fat, boneless pork loin. Here again with the pork loin, you could cut the loin in half and use two seasonings/marinades to work out your favorites. Keep us posted on your next smoke.
Any suggestions on what you would use for marinade/seasonings on the loin.
The emrils rub is at domanicks food store and the sweet baby rays should be there too.What town do you live in.I am sorry maybe i didnt read your first post right but 8 hours for 6 pounds of rib is well you found out very fall off the bone nice job.That drip pan must of been full with all that bacon on top. ;D
NDS,
Do what BigSmoke says, I use to hate spares but I have started using his method, trimmed them down to St' Louis style then after the cook time in the smoker I finish mine on the grill with my choice of sauce.
For get those spare ribs.Step up into the rolls royce of ribs.The ALMIGHTY Baby backs Ya get what ya pay for in life.Some skimp Others basks We HERE eat baby backs ;D When possible always but the best cut of meat ya can it make the world of differnce.
Bought a pork loin today from sams. Going to get after it tomorrow. I'm thinking the same rub I had for the ribs and hickory. Maybe top off with a little apple wood and then ftc with apple juice. I'll let you know how it turns out. Next weekend it will be the baby backs again.
ND Smoker,
I hope your weather forcast beats our weekend forcast. (Severe storms predicted).
I think you will be very happy with the pork loin in the BS.
I don't think you will really need to FTC. If you get the temp to 155f or 160f max you will be ready to go. The pork loin is usually used for slicing and not pulling like a pork butt.
Just FYI, I usually smoke for 2 1/2 hours at 200-210f using apple wood. My total time is usually 4-5 hours. I like to have a rack of bacon on top to keep the loin moist.
Let us know how the smoked pork loin turns out.
Our weather was great this weekend. I put the same rub as the ribs on the loin on Sat night and put in the smoker today. Smoked @ 210 for around 3 hrs with apple wood. Total time in the bradley was @ 5 hrs. Pulled it out at 157 and put on the grill in tinfoil at 350 until 170 with apple juice. Everybody was really happy with the results. I went back and forth through books ets on weather on not should cook past 160. Everything I read said a minimum of 160 so I hit it up to 170. It was still very moist etc. I will have to do the loin again. Next attempt is back to the baby back ribs I think (the real reason I bought the smoker). jaeger - you mention chicken breasts. Any good hints if I am starting from frozen stock from sams? I am a little worried about the chicken, temp cooking thing - does a guy need to cure them? The wife really likes chicken, would like to try them. Right now the best method I use is on the Weber with their beer cooker.
ND Smoker,
You have cooked chicken on the Weber so you are further along than a lot of backyard chefs. The whole chicken in the Bradley is somewhat similar but what I was referring to is Boneless Skinless Chicken Breast. First of all, you don't have to cure them. What I like about the bnl skls breast is that after you thaw them out, you can marinade and season them as you like and if you fill the top rack with bacon, they will not dry out. The last time I smoked chicken breast, I had 4 different varieties on at the same time. We smoked some extra for quick meals out of the freezer.
Here is a web page with some recommended internal temps for chicken.http://www.hormel.com/templates/knowledge/knowledge.asp?catitemid=24&id=149&floater=disabled (http://www.hormel.com/templates/knowledge/knowledge.asp?catitemid=24&id=149&floater=disabled)
The recommended temperatures on the Hormel website are overkill. It is no longer necessary to cook poultry to those temperatures. For whole chicken 165F measured at the thickest part of the thigh is a good temperature. If you are just doing breast meat, then 155F is good, and I know a few chefs that only cook the breast meat to 150F; for dark meat 165F is good or else the dark meat may be a little too tough.
So the internal temps of baby back ribs should be 185 -195. not to exceed 200.
I have to agree with Habanero on the Hormel site. Way overkill on the temps.
Hey ice see my post on temps in this same section any thought on it.
ND Smoker, here's my 2 cents worth: For ribs, it is pretty much a matter of personal preference as to the spare rib vs. baby back rib arguement. My preference is spare ribs because I get twice as much meat for about 1/2 the price. That aside, I would recommend using spare ribs until you get more comfortable with the results you want. The reason I say this is again as before - more meat, and less bone, makes these ribs a bit less tempermental and far less subject to the possibility of accidentally drying them out. In otherwords, you have a bit more room to experiment.
As to timing, I would figure at least 1-1/4 hours per lb. for smaller quantities (8-10 lbs), which will drop down toward the 1/2 hr. per lb. range for huge quantities. I just did 40 lbs. this weekend and it took about 23 hours in the smoker. I think the reason for this is that eventually with large quantities, as the cooking process continues, the ribs themselves become a heat source for each other, which does not occur with the smaller quantities. I generally do not transfer them to the oven (unless the weather is really bad) because this just means two appliances to clean, and I do not wrap in foil while cooking because I think this tends to steam the ribs and I want them dry roasted to render out as much fat as possible. I bring mine to the 189-190 degree range, but also check that the meat is receeding back from the ends of the bones, and you may also see references to the "twist test" in which a bone should be able to gently be twisted and the meat will not remain attached.
For prep, I agree with BigSmoker on not rubbing until you are ready to smoke, but for different reasons: he stumbled on this because he ran out of time. My reasoning is based on the fact that if you pat down the ribs and dry rub them, the seasoning goes on dry. If you wrap them and put them into the fridge overnight, you will get a result that looks mostly like they have been bathed in BBQ sauce. Where does the moisture come from? Obviously from the meat itself. I would rather leave it in there if the whole point is trying to not dry the ribs out in the first place. In addition, if you really want to set your product above the rest, you will want to start making your own rubs. Nothing against prepackaged, because I know there are many out there that people swear by, but for me, there is nothing better than freshly ground and mixed spices tailored to my own liking. The same goes for sauce. BBQ sauce is not hard to make yourself and the same arguement applies. If you want really outstanding sauce you should find a good base recipe and then experiment. I found a good one for KC-style sauce, which is based largely on ketchup (+ molasses, vinegar, and lots of spices). I went to fridge to make it, and I found no ketchup. So I found a no-cook ketchup recipe based on tomato paste and made that from scratch, again with fresh spices and vinegar, and that makes all the difference in the world.
For pork loin, I pull it out at 155 degrees. Habanero Smoker is right on with his temps for whole chicken.
So you wouldn't rub them until ready to smoke. Will have to try that on the ribs. Has anyone tried seasoning them @ half way through the cooking time. If I was going to move them into the oven I could even try it then. I have noted that grilled meat is better if seasoned close to the end of the process.
Never tried seasoning half way thru. Grilled meats and smoked meats are going to be two different animals IMO because of the temp and time they are cooked. I'm not sure the flavors would meld enough. Olds would probably know though. He's good at that sort of thing. Fire him an e-mail if you get a chance. He's given me all kinds of help in the past. I'm sure somebody out there has tried this so hang tight and somebody will post some info soon I'm sure.
ND Smoker,
If you want to be safe with poultry, read this latest info from the United States Department of Agriculture. These are minimum requirements for poultry,white or dark. These are regarding the safety standards that you were concerned about. This newsletter was posted by the gov on April 5, 2006.
http://www.fsis.usda.gov/News_&_Events/NR_040506_01/index.asp (http://www.fsis.usda.gov/News_&_Events/NR_040506_01/index.asp)
I don't want to sound like a nuisance about this; but I have to mention that white meat only has to be brought up to 155F. I state this because I have taken several "Food Enthusiast" classes (classes the general public can sign up for) at the Culinary Institute of America, and that is the temperature that they use for white meat.
I have to agree with Habanero. I was also taught this at CISC. White meat 155f Dark meat boneless 160f Dark meat bone in 165f. The USDA had to agree on (A SINGLE SAFE TEMP) so they had to go with the 165f. to cover all applications. Bummer to a novice cook that always ends up with leather dry chicken and can't figure out why. Brine on!!!
Quote from: Habanero Smoker on April 20, 2006, 03:09:51 AM
I don't want to sound like a nuisance about this; but I have to mention that white meat only has to be brought up to 155F. I state this because I have taken several "Food Enthusiast" classes (classes the general public can sign up for) at the Culinary Institute of America, and that is the temperature that they use for white meat.
I like to rub my meat the night before :o.IT has more penatrating powers ;D.Go ahead guys fire away LOL. ;D :D ;D ;)
Quote from: iceman on April 20, 2006, 09:28:23 AM
I was also taught this at CISC. White meat 155f Dark meat boneless 160f Dark meat bone in 165f. The USDA had to agree on (A SINGLE SAFE TEMP) so they had to go with the 165f. to cover all applications.
Also the 165F is an interesting temperature. That is the temperature at which all food borne bacteria is instantly killed. You have to hold the food at that temperature for 15 seconds. It's could be another reason why they picked that temperature. I might try my dark meat at 160F. The only reason I been going up to 165F is because I was told the dark meat will be too tough if it was not brought up to 165F.
Quote from: icerat4 on April 20, 2006, 09:37:47 AM
I like to rub my meat the night before :o.IT has more penatrating powers ;D.Go ahead guys fire away LOL. ;D :D ;D ;)
BANG! BANG! BANG! icerat. Just kidding :D Everyone has they're own way of doing things. That's what makes this forum so neat. Lots of different things to try. I love to experiment all the time. It's the only way to find things you might like. Rub away and anyway I say. ;D
I loved your rub ice. Its gota a little kick to it nice .Where do i sign up to actually buy some.Sure give us a sample get us hooked and then its all over.You ever live in the city of chicago.We have a name for you KINDA GUYS. LOL.Please give me a pm and ill buy some it works for me thanks for your help ice.