I think BBB is a brine recipe, if so... is there anyone that could post the recipe and directions for use. I'm interested in using a brine for venison backstraps.
JD
Well, JD it maybe a commercial cure...duh!
I would hate to interrupt your conversation with yourself but Canadian Bacon made from Venison backstraps is awsome. try a search for VCB.
Have you looked at any bacon recipes on the recipe site.
Bacon (http://www.susanminor.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=23)
Well, first I talk to myself alot....bad sign huh? I've been looking at some of the bacon recipes as I would like to try the canadian bacon recipe on a deer backstrap and I came across the BBB thing and thought it might be a brine recipe. Do you guys have a quick recipe? Probably going to try something with the backstraps this holiday and also a pork loin.
JD
Here's where I made VCB http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=8264.0 and the recipe I used
Buckboard Bacon or Canadian Bacon
1 Tablespoon per pound Morton's Sugar Cure/ Morton's Tender Quick
1 Tablespoon per pound white sugar or brown sugar
1 5lb pork loin or Boston butt or Venison Loin
1. Combine the sugar and Morton's Sugar Cure (one T of each for each pound of meat). This is your dry cure. Place the butt or loin in a large freezer bag and coat with the cure. Rub the cure into the meat, covering all sides. Squeeze the air out of the bag and seal. Store in the refrigerator for 1 day per pound of meat, flipping the meat over once a day. Liquid will begin to collect in the bag - this indicates that the cure is working. Do not drain it off.
2. When the meat is cured, remove the meat from the cure and soak in cold water for 1-2 hours to remove some of the salt. Dry off the meat and refrigerate for an hour.
3. Set up your smoker for indirect heat. Add hickory wood for smoke. If using Boston butt - cook at 225°F until the internal temperature of the meat hits 145°F. If using pork loin - cook at 225°F until the internal temperature of the meat hits 165°F.
4. Remove form the smoker, let cool, and slice. Note that the Canadian bacon is fully cooked and just needs to be warmed to serve. The Buckboard bacon is cured, but still needs to be cooked.
Just pulled my CB (pork, not venison) out of cure yesterday. Sitting in the refer now, forming the pellicle. Will smoke later today and then on to its two day rest period.
Big Buck has you started in the right direction. Don't hesitate to try other spices in conjunction. On one of mine, I added garlic and onion powder. On another, I added garlic, onion and jalapeno. Really, the only limits to CB is our imaginations.
Good luck. The rewards easily outweigh the work on this one.
SD
BBB
Big
Bad
Butts.................. ;D
nepas
I have a venison backstrap in the fridge now using the TQ cure. It's only about 3 lbs and has been in a little over 24 hrs. Do you think I need to take it out now and rinse and smoke?
JD
JDNC,
I will yield to Habs and the Duck but I think you should go longer. Feel of the meat. If it is not firm, it is not fully cured. Patience is a virtue. Wait for it. You will be happy!
KyNola
Quote from: JDNC on November 26, 2008, 07:13:18 PM
I have a venison backstrap in the fridge now using the TQ cure. It's only about 3 lbs and has been in a little over 24 hrs. Do you think I need to take it out now and rinse and smoke?
JD
According to Morton's you still have 48 hours to go 1 day per pound. I left my backstrap in for 4 days instead of 2 like the recipe called for and I still had the "eye" in the center where the cure didn't penetrate completely through. When curing it is best to err on the side of caution and be patient. Don't rush things let the cure do its magic you WILL be rewarded. In taste, flavor and compliments on a job well done. Since it has been wrapped in a bag for 24 hours go out and massage the liquid around a little and flip it over onto the other side. Do that again tomorrow. Rinse and smoke on the 4th day if you cant wait till the 5th just to be sure. That's my advice.
I have to agree with KYNola and 10.5. When I do my bacon, I put it in the cure for 6 days and my CBs usually are in the 5.5-6 lb range. They were certainly most correct when they said that patience is a virtue and this is true in all smokes. Let the meat tell you when it's done versus when you think it's done. After doing them for a while, you'll really get the feel for it and it will become second nature. I would err on leaving it in for 3-4 days and then going with the smoke. When you do take it out, cut a small piece off and fry it. If it's still too salty, throw it back in the cool bath, this will help reduce the saltiness a little more.
I'm sure Habs will ring in on this.....he's the true master of it. Everything I know, I learned from Habs.
SD
It depends on the cut and what method I use to cure. If I'm using a dry cure rub, for cuts like loins I generally go by thickness (at the widest point) not by pounds. I will estimate about 2 days per inch, but check for firmness each day.
This is not a very big backstrap, probably the largest end is approx 2.5-3 inches. As to firmness, I checked this morn and it seems somewhat firmer and darker in color but when I turned the meat over it had some red color where it touched the bottom of the bag. Is this normal or is this a sign it needs more time?
JD
The outer color should be uniformly darker. Have you been turning the bag over and redistributing the cure? I do this daily, others sources state to do it half way through the cure.
Most of the pork loins I make Canadian Bacon out of are about 3 inches thick, and I cure those for about 6 days.
Habs,
The color is darker (brown) and firmness more firm. I've been turning daily. I think I'll wait the full 6 days but would like to wait until the week-end took smoke. Can I keep in the cure longer, say 10 days and be ok..or do I need to remove and rinse and store in the fridge until the weekend?
JD
I would take it out of the cure, do the soak and put the time extention in the drying phase. I have done this more than once and it turned out great.
Leaving it the cure longer may make the meat too salty.
I do it slightly different. If I can't smoke right away, I rinse the cure off, soak it, and pat dry with paper towels. I will give the bag a good rinsing, place it back in a sealable bag and into the refrigerator. The day before I know I can smoke it, I will let it air dry uncovered in the refrigerator, or air dry it on the counter with a fan blowing on it for a couple of hours prior to smoking.
Ok, I think you're in agreement that I need to get it out of the cure and rinse. I'll rinse and store for the weekend for smoking.
Thanks, JD
Ok,
I took it out on the 4th day soaked and placed bag in a clean bag and back in the fridge. Today I soaked for about 30 minutes, patted down with paper towels and placed in the OBS at about 150* for two hrs. I then smoked at this temp for two hrs and increased the temp to about 180 and held to an IT of 153*. Tented for an hour and placed in zip-loc and back in the fridge. Later this evening I sliced a portion (as I can't wait two days) to sample. The outside 3/4 inch appeared to be cooked and the center was a blush red color. Is this normal, or was it not cured enough? I would post pic's but don't know how as of yet. I sliced it on a slicer and it looked like roast beef or slices of prime rib! Man was it good! As this was venison, I don't know what the color should look like after curing. I saw a post somewhere that showed a small grey spot in the center of a cured venison backstrap with the surrounding area a red color (mine is bassackwards). I'm going to wait for two days before slicing the rest if I can. I don't think I have ever tasted better venison. I wonder, has anyone ever tried brine curing a venison ham?
JD
If you can post a picture that would help. From your description it sound like it wasn't cured at all. Meat cures from the outside in, and as you stated your is just the opposite. If you have the "eye" in the middle it is not fully cured. Have you tasted it? Does it have a bacon or ham like taste?
Also can you post a link to recipe you used or list the ingredients you used. If you used a commercial cure mix, I've read that some commercial mixes don't add the cure to their mix, but rather put the cure in a packet and you have to add it to the mix yourself.
How to post photos (http://www.susanminor.org/forums/showpost.php?p=768&postcount=11)
Definitely gonna need to see a pic on this one.
Habs, If I understand what hes saying its cured on the inside center (Blush) but the outside is uncured and grey. But I did see where he says it was the best Bambi ever. I'm picturing the VCB I did but reversed red "eye" in the middle grey outer ring. Confused here but its early in the morning.
This was a small backstrap which I used Hab's basic CB cure instead of TQ. I weighed all ingredients and meat (digital scale). Placed in zip-loc and turned everyday in fridge at 40*. I posted questions ref time due to the size of straps and decided to take out and rinse on the 5th day giving me 4 days of cure time. Man it looks like prime rib sliced and is the best I've ever tasted! Just confused about the color after seeing yours. I've figured out the picture thing, just need to find my camera. I've got more I going to wait the two days on and when I slice I'll post pictures.
I don't know if anything can come out of a BS that could be bad..ha. I want to brine cure a venison ham with bone. Anyone have any experience with this?
JD
Hab's,
Forgot to answer your question ref taste. I don't think it taste like a ham, but it doesn't have a gamey or wild taste. I just about got my wife to try it as she thought it was sliced beef (she doesn't like deer and I think she would have liked this). I'm telling you, this was great tasting, I would like to get the same results on another backstrap.
You know, I would think that the center at 153* would be grey if not cured, what do you think? I thought that maybe due to the small size of the meat (1.5-2.5 inch) the grey outside might be due to the heat of the tower. I don't know, just know it taste great! Oh, I did heat some in the microwave and it come out steaming hot with the outside edges drying out some but the center still rosy red.
JD
Quote from: JDNC on December 07, 2008, 04:55:42 AM
I want to brine cure a venison ham with bone. Anyone have any experience with this?
JD
I haven't tried this one yet. I only have one word of caution. For what its worth I would bone out the venison ham first. Since this CWD thing, I dont mess with any bones. Don't cut them or leave them in anything. There isn't enough info out there on CWD and nobody knows what it will do to humans. So I will tend to err on the safer side. I don't think they have even found a case here in Iowa, but I ain't taken any chances.
With that said. Let us know how it turns out if you give one a whirl. Buy opening the ham up you ensure that the large chunk of "Star Fat" is removed from the lower half along with the large gland that is with it.
10.5
I'm with you on the de-boning of venison. I think it tastes a whole lot better if you don't have the bones in. In my opion it gives it more aof a gamey taste.
Coleman I only debone because of CWD or I would leave them in Meat always tastes better cooked with the bone in. But then again I am eating corn feed venison here in Iowa.
Well here go's this picture thing...
Here is what I sliced yesterday, which most has been digested by now!
(http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq312/JDNC/vcb2.jpg)
Might see this a little better.
(http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq312/JDNC/vcb1.jpg)
What do you guys think?
I'm gonna have to bow out and leave this one to Hab's since I went back and looked and you used his dry rub. Which might be the reason it doesn't look like the VCB I did. I used the TQ and Brn Sugar cure on mine. But I will ask this "Does it taste good? Is it the flavor you was after? If you answered Yes to them two questions then IMHO you did it right. You can always try it again.
On second thought....i don't think it cured as it's not firm enough. It's too limp and soft. I'm going to try this again but I think I'll throw away my cure and mix up new just in case I made a mistake with the ingredients.
JD
JDNC
It just doesn't look cured??? Not that it looks bad, in fact it looks great! Just doesn't have the appearance of being cured. How was the taste? Could you taste the hammy/bacon flavor which is the signature cure taste?
Mike
It taste great, just as it looks! Now...as for having a ham or bacon taste, if it does it's not very much. As a matter of fact it taste a lot like roast beef with a smoke taste. I wouldn't care if they all could taste as good, but was looking for a firm texture with a rose color throughout and was wondering if I got something wrong. I really didn't know what to expect with venison anyway. I will say it's not salty..it's just right as salt goes, but doesn't it supposed to more firm and red? I think I'll try a pork loin next as I have two in the freezer.
JDNC
You right regarding the firmness... I usually give them a flip every day or two in the fridge and this is when you will notice them getting firmer. If not firm I just wait another day or two and check again. It's a puzzle for sure.
Still looks great though! ;)
Mike
If you've been reading different curing threads, BBB likely stands for buckboard bacon.
If used in the phrase "I used BBB to cure my belly" then it refers to the commercial spice/cure Buckboard Bacon manufactured by Hi-Mtn Jerky.
Buckboard bacon as a meat - "man I can't believe how good buckboard bacon tastes" then its the meat itself and refers to a boston butt cured into lean bacon.
BBB and Canadian bacon are not the same thing, as was mention on about page 1.
The directions on BBB say to use butt. It is what they used in the pioneer days. They did not waste the fat on the belly/side by making modern bacon, it was need for lye soap.
It was kind of funny I found this thread today, because I am minutes away from using BBB to cure some sides. I prefer the Butcher and Packer maple cure, but I ran out and don't think I can get it up here. Mallardwacker sent me some up the U.S.
JDNC;
It doesn't matter if you use TQ or the Basic Cure Mix, it cures from the outside in. If the meat did not cure at all, the only thing I can think of is you may have made an error when you made the Basic Cure. When you made the Basic Cure, did it have a slightly pink color to it?
I've never seen anything like this, on any solid muscle I've used a dry cure on. You are right that at 153°F, the meat should have been grey. The pictures are kind of small, is there any way you can post one of them larger. The meat appears to be rare, because it looks so moist (or it could be the reflection of the flash).
Habs,
I used 1 lb of salt, 8 oz sugar, and 2 oz of Pink salt (6.22% sodium nitrite). I weighed every ingredient, did not measure anything. When I used the cure I measured 1 Tbls per pound. As for the color, no it really doesn't have a pink color, after mixing. My pink salt is not as pink as it was (couple yrs old) but I don't think that's the problem, but could have made a mistake when weighing everything out.
If I question anything it would be the salt. I had what I thought was pickling salt in a big bag, not a box. I looked tonight to make sure, and can't find any thing on the bag that says it's iodized but who knows. I have salt on hand that I've had around for a long time that came in bags that I thought was pickling salt, but can't remember. I made this assumption due to the fact it didn't say iodized salt. Could this be the problem? Anyway, before I try to cure again I'm going to mix up another batch of your "Basic Cure" using pickling salt I just purchased this week-end. If I had to bet money, I would bet I weighed out something wrong when mixing the basic cure (my life story).
JD
JDNC;
This one is a mystery to me. Do you live in the states. If you do, the pink salt should have been pink. Manufacturers (at least most) having been adding the pink dye for many years, to prevent chefs from accidentally mistaking it for salt. Do your recall it ever being pink? Also most manufacturers use a 6.25%, but I don't believe the .03% makes a difference. Though sodium nitrite has a long shelf life, heat can effect it's usefulness, as well as moisture.
I've never used iodize salt for curing, but besides giving the food an off-taste, it could have caused the discoloration. Also if the salt is not purified (a method of manufacturing use in most mined salt), it could contain other metals. So you may be on to something; as to the type of salt that was used. But I do still have some concerns about the sodium nitrite you are using. :)
Habs,
I live in US, NC as a matter of fact. As for the color of the pink salt I purchased it from Eldon's Jerky and Sausage Supply, in ID. I have a 16oz plastic container which the label states (in reference to ingredients),
Ingredients: Salt, Sodium Nitrite (6.22%), Dextrose, FD & C Red #3 (0.00084%), less than 1.0% Glycerine to prevent caking.
The color is a light pink, lighter than it had been when I first purchased it. My guess is, it has lost 1/4-1/2 the color it once had. This container has been stored inside in a cool dark location in a box away from sunlight. When you asked about the color of my basic cure, a flag came up in my mind, as I know that my mixture was white. I may have screwed up, but believe me I don't think the mixture could have much pink color due to the now light pink color of my pink salt. I also don't think the pink salt can go bad during storage, but I don't think it has the color it once had (but it is pink).
Again, I think I probably made a mistake in weighing ingredients for the Basic Cure.
JD