Sorry it took so long. Mixing HTML and iB codes has been a big pain. Nestling problems I had to figure out. Plus there is no such thing as Tabs or frames in posting boards so I that also took me a while to come up with a work-about for the "charts."
Anyway here is the addy: see a few postings down.
And with that Good night Ms Gracy
http://rminor.com
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Oldman</i>
<br />Sorry it took so long. Mixing HTML and iB codes has been a big pain. Nestling problems I had to figure out. Plus there is no such thing as Tabs or frames in posting boards so I that also took me a while to come up with a work-about for the "charts."
Anyway here is the addy:
http://www.susanminor.org/cgi-bin/iB3/ikonboard.cgi?s=93b0edb953b7c0b81848b4726ffc1734;act=ST;f=36;t=126;r=1;&
And with that Good night Ms Gracy
http://rminor.com
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
John
Newton MA
damn it another conflict in the codes... charts now messed up...will fix it I as soon as I find the bad coding or my mistake.
Edit: Ok all fixed. Here is the new addy:
http://www.susanminor.org/cgi-bin/iB3/ikonboard.cgi?s=1541176ac8d3cfc7d64c0e09d7fa82cc&act=ST&f=36&t=126&st=
http://rminor.com
Oldman,
Curing and brining looks very good. The only item I saw of concern was the high end of the brining time for whole turkey. I usually have seen this as 12-24 hours. 2 days of brining anything will probably turn it into a saltlick, as I'm sure SmokinMoe will attest.
bsolomon talk with JJC about this. He did the research. My best guess is it all depends upon how strong your brime is, but I do agree that two days is kind of high for most brimes. However, I don't believe it would high with the one I use on chicken, if I was to brine a whole turkey for two days. It does reflect 12 hours to 2 days.
Perhaps you and JJC can come up with the wording explain this point I will just unlock the thread and add your reply! Ya! That way I don't have to worry with those stupid conflicting codes again. YUCK!
Now I will tell you why I hate posting boards for rich content. As simple as that lay-out looks there are over 60 codes and tags in that posting. You miss sometthing closer in the top it might not show up until the bottom of the post...!!! Or the problem shows up every where. I'm sure there are those smarter that me and this would have been a piece O cake. This is a simple example. Let say you use the [ list ] command and when you go to close it and you forget the [/] part of the close. That will effect every [ list ] [ /list ] tag below it. This sounds like a simple fix until it is mixed with HTML codes and then you made a mistake in the damn nestling.
I want clean HTML and CSS and to *ell with mixing this stuff on a posting board.... Momma Save Me from the Code Moster~~! LOL![:p]
http://rminor.com
I thought it was too, but most sources confirmed those brining times for turkey. Brining times depends on the weight/size of the turkey. For a turkey that is 10-12 pounds, the brining times could be 12-24 hours. If you have a turkey that is 24 pounds, it take longers.
Olds,
Very impressive, You did a great job!![^]
<i><font color="blue"><b>Jack</i></font id="blue"></b>
Thanks for the kind words Bassman & bsolomon.
This is what my Webmaster had to say about it:
"I bet that took an eternity to get right. [:D]"
Well one thing for sure the learning curve was high, but now it is flat [^][^][^] !
http://rminor.com
Hi All,
Just wanted to reply to the concern about the brining times for turkeys (12 hr - 2 days). bsolomon e-mailed earlier and I already replied to him before I realized it was a Forum topic. Here's the gist of my reply:
First of all, bsolomon's comments (and e-mail to me), and the dicussions on this thread are EXACTLY what we need to encourage to make sure the finished product is maximally useful for All BSers, especially the newbies.
Second, Habanero is correct when he points out the the best available sources, including the USDA, recommend up to 2 days brining time for turkey.
Third, bsolomon is also correct when he points out that the experience of Bsers clearly indicates that more than 24 hr of brining makes the turkey too salty.
I thought this might be a conflict between preservation/safety and taste, so I called a contact at the FDA. He reported back to me that the rule of thumb that provides excellent safety and still should keep the taste from getting too salty is to brine for approximately 1 hour per pound for turkey. This is also consistent with the other poultry brining recommendations given in this section. Thus, a small 12 lb. bird should be brined for about 12 hours, while a big 24-26 pounder could get a day or slightly more in the brine. He also suggested using more sugar to counteract the saltiness, rather than short-change the salt concentration. He also felt that since most of us don't leave turkey or any other birds out at room temp for more than a couple of hours at the most, we should err on the side of shortening the brining time, rather than reducing the time.
My thought was to change the current "12 hours - 2 days" to "1 hour per pound" on that section, but if anyone has a different suggestions, please don't hesitiate to make it! [:)]
John
Newton MA
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by JJC</i>
<br />
I thought this might be a conflict between preservation/safety and taste, so I called a contact at the FDA. He reported back to me that the rule of thumb that provides excellent safety and still should keep the taste from getting too salty is to brine for approximately 1 hour per pound for turkey. This is also consistent with the other poultry brining recommendations given in this section. Thus, a small 12 lb. bird should be brined for about 12 hours, while a big 24-26 pounder could get a day or slightly more in the brine. He also suggested using more sugar to counteract the saltiness, rather than short-change the salt concentration. He also felt that since most of us don't leave turkey or any other birds out at room temp for more than a couple of hours at the most, we should err on the side of shortening the brining time, rather than reducing the time.
My thought was to change the current "12 hours - 2 days" to "1 hour per pound" on that section, but if anyone has a different suggestions, please don't hesitiate to make it! [:)]
John
Newton MA
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
This is one of the best advice I have read about brining. As you probably already know, the more you read about brining, the more you come across diverse views on what brining does, what should the salt concentration be, and how long to brine.
Yes I agree with Habanero Smoker. In fact I've read JJC work on this matter several times and the more I have read it the more the light has come on. My understand is clearer now.
Olds
http://rminor.com
You've been a busy man Olds! Nice site and I like the links to the pets and Bradley!
"A mans got to know his limitations"
Chattaroy, WA - USA!
Thank you for all your hard work on this site. It is great.
I have received some Morton's Sugar Cure (smoke flavored)from a friend. He said he has used it as a brine with brown sugar and spices for jerky. He never did give me measurements. Any suggestions or recipes?
Thanks
Jeanne (green horn)
Hi Jeanne- here's a link I found- maybe it will answer some of your questions- good luck! I believe on the back of the bag that the cure comes in it says to use 1 Tbsp (or tsp?) per pound of meat. Sorry- can't recall which one...
http://www.alliedkenco.com/data/data_sheets/morton_curing_directions.htm
Cold Smoke
Thank you so much cold. I have it in the brine. I can hardly wait to smoke it up tomorrow! [:D]
Hi Jeanne,
The most important thing to do with something like Mortons Sugar Cure, which contains nitrite, is be certain you follow the instructions for how much to use. Sometimes people subsitute these cures for salt in a recipe, or they think that if 1 Tablespoon is good that 10 Tablespoons must be better. Of course there's a level of safety built into the recommended amounts, but nitrites and nitrates can be toxic if used at levels well above the recommended amounts. That being said, however, a lot of research has been analyzed on possible harmful effects of nitrites and nitrates and the solid conclusion is that they are absolutely fine if used at the recommended levels.
Let us know how it turns out! [:p][:)]
John
Newton MA
Hi Olds,
Just sent you an e-mail with a small change to make to the Curing and Brining section. Based on the comments and suggestions of several Members (thanks to all of you) we should replace the "12 hr - 2 days" recommendation for the brining time of turkey to "1 hour per pound (a good rule of thumb for all poultry)". If I can do this myself, let me know how. Otherwise, thanks for taking care of it. Your work on that board is masterful, man![8D]
John
Newton MA
Changes have been made...
Fuzzybear how is the new house? Do you have a lot of snow? How are your dog adjusting?
About this area for the Bradley stuff...well it just kind of happened. I got a feeling it will be months before we see the finished product. Even then there will always be something to add.
http://rminor.com
Snow/melt/snow/rain/snow/melt...kind of how it's been since moving up here. During the melt, I've got standing water at the back of the house and side of the house - I will need to contract an excavator and have those areas graded to slope away from the house to let the water drain. Thank God I don't have a basement as I'm sure by now it would have been flooded...
The dogs? Well they are warm weather friends and have had a heck of a time adjusting to the cold...I can't let them out yet by themselves as I don't have a fenced yard for them and they would be "yote" bait in a second or maybe from Hawks or Owls too.
We are adjusting slowly but surely and I'm sure we'll all adapt somehow cuz I ain't movin' agin'!!!
"A mans got to know his limitations"
Chattaroy, WA - USA!
Glad to hear you're settling in to the new digs, Fuzzy.I was wondering how you were doing. Just wait till spring and you get those beautiful days in the mid 70's--good for smoking!
Tom
I smoked my jerky today. It turned out ok. I really need a slicer. Does anyone have any information on a good brand? Thanks.
Jeanne
jeanne,
I'm going to give ya a lot of information here. After reading it you might say wow. I don't know if I want to go this route. At the bottom of this posting I will share a secret with ya that might just convince you to go this route.
There are two ways you can go. A new unit made for light use home owners or a good used commercial unit. Next, vertical units are the more dangerous of the two. This is why unless the vertical unit is an auto feeder--auto slicer i.e. Berkel 18 inch vertical, you don't see them in delis or in restaurants. Vertical blade units are known for slicing fingers when you get to the end of what you are slicing.
Next the smallest blade size that is acceptable is 12 inches. Those 10 inch model are generally for very light duty. At the moment your needs might only require a 10 inch model; however, needs change and the cost difference on the used market is not worth the saving of a few dollars.
The two brands that I would look for in a used unit are a Hobart or a Berkel. IMO you will pay more for the Berkel. However, I belive it is made of better metal.
This picture is a Hobart 12 inch manual. It looks like to me to be a single speed unit. (Some units are dual speed.)Used under $1000.00. New around $3200.00.
(http://a-zrestaurantequipment.com/HobartSlicer204.jpg)
The is a Berkel 12 inch manual. I also looks like a single speed unit.
(http://a-zrestaurantequipment.com/BerkelSlicer2719.jpg)
All Hobart and Berkel unit have blade sharpeners on them. [:D] This is very important!!!!
Now there are also medium usage slicers. This one below is a Berkel 12 inch model. New it can be found for under $900.00. If I found one of these in a used restaurant supply house in really good shape I would purchase it. I 'm guessing $350.00 to $500.00–used. Below is a ppicture of medium usage slicer. I do not believe that you or your kids, or grand children, as home users, could ever wear this unit out.
(http://shop.efriedman.com/productimages/foodpreparation/foodslicers/berkelfoodslicers/827E.jpg)
<b>Ok now one to the secret.</b> For 6 months I looked for a high quality used radiant gas grill. I got a Castile 30 inch for $650.00. It was 6 months old and one half of it had never been used. It sold new from $2100.00--$2,500.00. Yes it took me 6 months to find what I wanted, but the effort was worth the looking. Also, look at the ratio of used verse new in cost for a unit that is all but new! In this case it is between 32% and 38% of new. That is a heck of a savings for a unit that will outlast you, your children and all of your grandchildren.
My suggestion is for you to find every hole in the wall that sells used restaurant equipment. Sooner or later you will run across the correct unit and the guy is really going to want to sell it. When you start looking go into these places as a "lost-woman!" Humbly lost. Ask them what should I look for? How can I tell when a slicer is too used? When they ask you how much you are going to be using it, reply a lot but I'm not sure as I have family that will be using it too.
Ask about the sharping stones, and how do they work. Are they worn-out? If so that unit has seen some usage. If the unit looks rather used and it has new stones I might think twice about purchasing that unit. It takes a lot of usage to wear out a set of stones. On the other hand the slicer might have been owned by a person who will not have a small trailing cut edge, so he sharpens it 10 times per day.
At this point you got to use some common sense and look the whole unit over. Stones are just one of the areas you need to look at. Another is the drive unit itself--the piece with the handle on it to push with. Is it loose? If so, it is because the drive unit is not tightened down or is it because the bushings are worn-out?
Next when the unit is running and you push down on the center guard of the blade does the outer edge of the guard rub on the blade..if so I would think twice before I purchased that unit.
In closing this rather long reply I will say I have owned half a dozen Hobarts--all good units. However, without a doubt the finest unit I ever owned was a vertical 18" auto feed, auto slicer by Berkel. It was a TANK! Not only in Power, in Speed, but the cut never ragged-out onthe back end of the slice, This thing was also a TANK in Size....40-50 pounds. I bet 20 years after I owned it, is still slicing the finest of roast beef. [^] Many a year has past since then and I've kicked myself a many time for selling it.
<hr noshade size="1">Now this is the one I would imagine that <b><font color="red">nsxbill</font id="red"></b> would purchase as <b><i>he is into toys.</b></i>
This digital Vertical Auto Feeder, Auto slicer---Price for new? Who knows? LOL
(http://www.hollyss.com/834_3.jpg)
(http://www.hollyss.com/834.jpg)
Or I could see <b><font color="red">nsxbill</font id="red"></b> getting into this puppy~~~!
<i>Berkel 180GS Slicer with Interleaver: Automatic Slicer/Stacker/Shingler with Conveyor & Stand. 24" Product Table and 14 1/2" S.S. Knife, 1 Speed - 50 Slices per Minute. 1/3 HP, 115/60/1. Berkel Interlever for 180GS: Choice of Cut-offs in either 3 ½", 4" or 4½". 115-220/50-60/1</i> This unit is from $4000-$5000 used.
(http://www.hollyss.com/180GS.gif)
Sorry nsxbill...just having fun with ya.<hr noshade size="1">
One more item I laugh about are all of the grinders etc. I see listed for the home user....What a ripe off in pricing.
How about $250.00 for a good used unit like this one!
(http://www.home-processor.com/TORM12FS.jpg)
One last point concerning used Restaurant equipment. You would be shocked at the number of people that get into the restaurant business and don't know which end of a carrot goes into a stock pot.
I remember back in 1977 I purchase an entire <b><i>Cafeteria Serving Line</i></b>-- I'm talking about a hundred footer of both hot and cold units, not some small buffet line. I got it for $6,100.00. It was less than 2 years old--12 gauge stainless steel. Included in that price was also a brixing soda machine, a slicer, and two stainless steel refrigerators and a stainless steel freeze! New at that time I would guess $60,000.00 minumim.
I could go on like the time I got 200 settings of real flatware. Not that chrome stuff....for a dollar per setting, but I won't. I will stop here.
It just takes time and a lot of looking is all. If you go this route in the end you will have something that WORKS smoothly, never breaks or wears-out. Talk about the WoW factor...just wait until your friends and family see what you got as a toy...
Olds
http://rminor.com
Thank you for all the information. I will ponder it for a while. [^]
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Thank you for all the information. I will ponder it for a while. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
You are welcome!
Olds
Opps I was editing it jeanie as you posted...the last part. Sorry.
http://rminor.com