Just finished my second smoke with my SSBS. 6 whole chickens and two wild turkey breast to take to my wife's family for a 4th of July cook out.
I plugged in my SSBS, turned the heat all the way to the right, wide open. Plugged in my Maverick 73 and watched the pit temp. I set my meat out (about an hour) and did my final prep work while my Bradley pre-heated to 255. Loaded 9 hickory pucks and 3 Bubba Pucks. The draft was open to 1/4 open.
After 7 hours the pit temp did not reach 200 at any time. I <u><b>ONLY </b></u>opened the door at the 4 hour mark to change the water. Obviously, the pit temp dropped again. The draft was left at 1/4 open and the temp slider was still all the way to the right during the whole time. I had two different thermometers (1 in one chicken and 1 in the turkey) after 7 hours the meat temps were 158 and 159.
Because of time constraints, I had to finish the birds on the grill. All of the meat tasted great. I can't complain about that, tender, juicy, just the amount of smoke I like.
I had a Brinkman smoker ($69 job) and the two main reasons I bought a SSBS was 1.) I liked the open door with 4 trays 2.) the pit temp could controled ( the Brinkman it is plug in and that's it)
However, I am not really impressed when after 7 hours, the pit temp still is not 200 and the meat temp is not 160. I know that I had quite a bit of meat and that meat mass takes up more space than air mass, but I mean there are four racks so I should be able to use them.
I have a Weber Summit Platinum 6 burner grill with a designated smoke box. I can do some indirect grilling and use hickory in the smokebox and do a better job than I have so far with my Bradley. But the smoke box is not designed to hold alot of hickory so it would not be practical to do 6 birds because I would have to keep filling up the smoke box, but I can control the pit temp a million times better than I have so far with my Bradley.
I know "slow and low" is the only way to go. I was allowing my self 8 hours for these birds and at the rate I was going it wasn't going to happen any time soon.
Obviously, I am doing something wrong, but for the life of me I don't know what it is. As excited as I was about getting my Bradley, I am that disapointed with the performance thus far.
Hope you guys can shed some light for me.
Thanks in advance.
Sorry you are disappointed, but I'm impressed that you attempted to smoke six whole chickens, and two turkey breast at the same time. [:D] If you were measuring the internal temperatures in the deepest part of the thigh, I would have pulled them at 160 F, and the temperature would have continue to rise to at least 165 F, which is considered done.
I have had similar experience when I smoked two chickens and a 12 pound turkey at the same time. When too much moisture is released during the smoking process, the cabinet temperature will drop. This happens more often when you are smoking whole poultry, or any poultry with the skin on. Most of the moisture of an animal is contained within the skin, that is why you do not have the same problem when you smoke red meat, and fish.
With that size load of poultry, and only having the vent 1/4 open, there is generally a problem of liquid running out of the bottom of the door. If you noticed that, open the vent further, you want to avoid any liquid making it's way to the electrical wiring.
Yeah Hab, I did have problem with moisture, the most being during the time when I changed water at the 4 hour point. Not as bad afterward. I thought that leaving the vent 1/4 open would let the unit get hotter.
Is this not correct?
Also, I thought chicken internal temps were to get to 180.
I'm not going to give up on my Bradley, it just hasn't lived up to my expectations to this point.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Grillin and Chillin</i>
<br />Yeah Hab, I did have problem with moisture, the most being during the time when I changed water at the 4 hour point. Not as bad afterward. I thought that leaving the vent 1/4 open would let the unit get hotter.
Is this not correct?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Yes; as a general rule. But when you have moisture build up inside the cabinet, it is better to sacrifice temperature, then have the moisture leak into electrical components and short you system out. As you noted, after 4 or 5 hours, most of the moisture has escaped from the skin, and you can then close the vent back to 1/4 open.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Grillin and Chillin</i>
<br />
Also, I thought chicken internal temps were to get to 180.
I'm not going to give up on my Bradley, it just hasn't lived up to my expectations to this point.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
That is the FDA recommendation, but today the consensus is 165 F for whole poultry, and 150-155 F for breast meat.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">That is the FDA recommendation, but today the consensus is 165 F for whole poultry, and 150-155 F for breast meat.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I was not aware of this, I'll have to check it out the next time I cook chicken. But, it seems in the past, when I have checked whole chicken especially, that under 180 the meat is still read around the bone areas.
Thanks for the input so far.
Fur & Feather Outfitters
Archery Assault Team
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">But, it seems in the past, when I have checked whole chicken especially, that under 180 the meat is still read around the bone areas. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Sorry, meant to say still "red" around the bone.
Fur & Feather Outfitters
Archery Assault Team
I use to think that 180 F was necessary, but last September I learned that the Culinary Institute of America train their chef's on the temperatures I posted, and in addition train them to pull the poultry out of the oven at 155-160 F, since the internal temperature will continue to rise after it has been pulled out of the oven. Of course they recheck the internal temperature to make sure that it has risen to at least 165 F.
Red around the bone can be a sign that the chicken is under cooked, but not always. It is not unusual to see red around the bone of fully cooked chicken or turkey when it is cooked low and slow, also if the poultry was very young when it was butchered, will show signs of red around the bone when fully cooked, even when these younger birds are roasted at higher temperatures.
Wow Habs, that's great info.[:D] I try to learn something everyday and you sure taught me something today.
Thanks for all the great info!!!!!![:)]
Fur & Feather Outfitters
Archery Assault Team
If you are interested in the "science" of food you should pick up a copy of "On Food and Cooking: The Science and Lore of the Kitchen"; by Harold McGee. It's a great reference book. If you can't find it at a local bookshop, you can get if from Amazon.com.
Habs is right, you know. Modern chicken slaughtering methds do not always allow the chicken to bleed out entirely to the outside. It was discovered that when killed by modern methods, some of the blood migrates towards the bones. It is one of the reasons why chickens slaughtered by modern methods and those slaughtered by, say, decaptitation (where there is a good external bleed) do not taste the same.
B.F.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">It is one of the reasons why chickens slaughtered by modern methods and those slaughtered by, say, decaptitation (where there is a good external bleed) <b>do not taste the same.</b>
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I had no idea that the taste would differ!
Which method gives the best taste?
(If I could place a bet it would be........ decap!)
/Lasse
Somewhere I read an article about the "red" problem. Best I can remember this was caused by what Hab said the age of the chicken. The chickens are harvested as soon as possible and at a fairly young age. Their bones are not as developed as an older chicken so you get the "red" because the marrow comes through the bone much esaier in the young bones. It has nothing to do with the chicken being undercooked as I recall. If this is bad info and I just dreamed I read this article please disregard[:)].
Jeff
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/Jeff100/shopping.gif)
(//www.bbqshopping.com)
Some say BBQ is in your blood, if thats true my blood must be BBQ sauce.
In the summer of my 17th birthday I work in a chicken slaughtered house. In those day (if you go a weak stomach stop and don't read further) live chicken were hanged upside down. We would then decaptitate them--manually.
Today the manually as I understand it has been removed.... kind of like our off sourcing of jobs to china. CHEAP-O! This leave much blood in the bird. I'm told that that the auto does not work as well as we would like.
This is way I will not purchase supermarket chickens. I'm not a PETA person... but damn it all at least do some honor to the bird.
Then in our local newspaper there was that story about those dick-heads who where kicking to death live chickens in a slaughter house.
My dog, your dog, my cat, your cat, a chicken for a meal should not be beat to dead.
They is more blood in the meat of chickens today because of A-holes then ever before.
IMO no animal should die painfully so we can have BBQ or a Smoked item.
Perhaps someone does not agree with me... If not I await your reply.
Olds
(http://www.susanminor.org/Rayeimages/gif/Launch47.gif)
I am a hunter and consumer of meat and I will say anyone that kick's an animal to death has mental problems. Most of the animals I kill are dead before they even know I'm around. If for some reason the one shot kill doesn't happen then they are dispatched ASAP. I do not condone cruelty. I also do not like PETA. They have killed animals just to prove a point and disposed of the carcass in a dumpster.
I feel the same way. I use to raise chickens when I was younger, for both meat and eggs. When you kill an animal for food, you must do it as humanly as possible.
I started this thread because I was disapointed with the performance of my Bradley to this point.[V]
However, this has turned out to be "All you ever wanted to know about chickens, but were afraid to ask"[:0]LOL
Really great info on poultry. Keep up the good work
Fur & Feather Outfitters
Archery Assault Team
Sorry to go on...
About your BS, I hope you find some information that helps you have a better experience with your smoker.
Well, gee........I guess that answers that!
Good info on the red bone...I've notice it also but as long as blood wasn't running out and the juices were clear I didn't give it much thought. I go to 165 degrees with my yard birds.
"A mans got to know his limitations"
Am I the only one who has had the problem of the pit temp being at least 255 when cranked wide open but when putting quite a bit of meat in, the temp never got over 200 afterwards?
I thought I had read where somewhere on these forums where guys were cooking several butts at temps like 210 to 220. However, I cant' seem to reach those temps with meat in the smoker.
Am I missing something?
Fur & Feather Outfitters
Archery Assault Team
I hate to say this but I have no problems hitting 275 F. before I add the meat.
Olds
(http://www.susanminor.org/Rayeimages/gif/Launch47.gif)
I smoke at 200 - 210 F; and only have problems reaching those temperatures when I have a large load of chicken. On the other hand, I have never had more then two trays full with red meat; usually consisting of 1 butt, and 1 brisket.
I have no problem hitting 275°f either. I normally don't cook more than a couple of items at a time either.
Jeff
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/Jeff100/shopping.gif)
(//www.bbqshopping.com)
Some say BBQ is in your blood, if thats true my blood must be BBQ sauce.
G and C,
Just a few of my mis-guided and somewhat boring uniformed thoughts here.
I am sorry for your disappointment, nothing worse than a bum smoke.
First I have always noticed that when doing chickens and I fill my BS up, I do notice that the temp of the BS does take a long time to come up to temp. I believe this is because of the amount of moisture that the birds give off when smoking. I know this doesn't help you out. Yes I do believe it should come up to temp faster. For some reason I don't experience this with another type meat.
Secondly, that was heck of a lot bird carcass you had going at one time and coupled with above for mentioned theory I think this where you disappointment came from.
This probably won't help your feelings at all but sometimes packing out the BS may not be the way to go. I know it seems like you should be able to but personally I wouldn't recommend it.
I don't know what to tell you but I too (and all of us on this forum) have found these type of limitations with the BS. This however doesn't nullify what the BS can do, and do very well. I love my BS. It has allowed me to enjoy things I never could before with such consistency and flavor.
(http://www.susanminor.org/Rayeimages/mallardwacker/peta-sucks.gif)
SmokeOn,
(http://www.azbbqa.com/forum/phpbb2/images/avatars/gallery/AZBBQA/mallardsmall.gif)
mski
Perryville, Arkansas
Wooo-Pig-Soooie
If a man says he knows anything at all, he knows nothing what he aught to know. But...
Thanks Mallard, your repsonse made the most sense to me.
I'll just keep smokin' and see what happens
Thanks again
Fur & Feather Outfitters
Archery Assault Team
Hi G+C,
I think Mallard and Hab were saying pretty much the same thing, but I wanted to add one thing for you to consider, especially when smoking large amounts of moisture-laden items (ie, fowl). A number of use put a brick or three (brick in this case is a generic term--could be a typical red brick, or a fire brick, or even apporp[riately shaped rocks) in the bottom of the smoker to act as a heat sink. Perhaps if you pre-heated the BS with as many bricks as you can get in there, you would be able to achieve a bit more heat. It's tough, because the boiling point of water is 212, so if moisture is the culprit then it's hard to go above that temp until most of the moisture is gone, but at the very least you will get much better heat recovery when you do have to open the door at 4 hr or other times. HTH
John
Newton MA
Well prior to my chicken extravaganza, I had done only one other smoke. It was a 5 lb pork tenderloin and I didn't have any problems.
Oh well, I guess I'll just have to smoke something else and do some more research. [:D] Guess I'll have to do some more "product" testing and send up some smoke.
Thanks everyone
Work is for people who don't hunt
Mr. Flay, or can I call you Bobby?[:)]?,
You're not using an extention cord are you? The outlet you're plugging into isn't on the same circut as a refrigerator or a washing machine? The Bradley will heat up pretty hot with nothing inside, but when you cram in a ton of food will take very long to come up to temp.
If I smoke a butt for Anne & I, it will be done in 5-6 hours. When I do 4 at a time for the parties, it will take 12-16. (Or 26 when you accidentally position a butt on the 2nd rack so when it cooks, the bone expands out & pushes the door open.[B)])
Meat mass is a whole lot different than air & the recovery time can drastically differ. Our big smokes when we pack in 35-40# per need at least 4 hours for the cut up & smaller stuff, up to 6 hours for the pork loin.
HTH,
Kirk
http://www.chezbubba.com
Ya think next time I check into a hotel & they ask "Smoking or Non?" they would mind?
(spoken as they would say Norm! on Cheers)Cheeeeeeeeeeeeeeezzzzzzzzzzzzz!!!!!!!!!!! I thought you'd fallen off the face of the earth. Glad to see ya back.
No extension cord. It was plugged into an outside outlet, in which at the time I wired my home per the electrical code at the time in 1994, only 4 outside outlet per breaker(on a GFI). Since I wired my own home I know which four are on this breaker and nothing else was plugged into those outlets.
No it came up to temp empty fine. However as in my orignal post, After 7 hours the pit temp did not reach 200 at any time. I ONLY opened the door at the 4 hour mark to change the water. Obviously, the pit temp dropped again. The draft was left at 1/4 open and the temp slider was still all the way to the right during the whole time. I had two different thermometers (1 in one chicken and 1 in the turkey) after 7 hours the meat temps were 158 and 159.
I had left the temp wide open the whole time. I guess I thought becasue it had four racks I could use them all at the same time. This one of the main reasons I purchased the unit that AND tempature control. But I could not control the temp.
Work is for people who don't hunt
EDITED OUT
I'm wrong and Grillin and Chillin is right on the money~~! I totally mis-read misunderstood what he had said. I have sent a personal E-mail to him asking him to overlook me being stupid.
Oldman is my hero once again![:D] If someone read this post before I edited it out and it offended anyone, I apologize.
I would like to thank everyone for their help. I know that I have not yet scratched the surface as to what my SSBS can do. I will have to keep smokin' so I can learn, which is a good thing[:D]. However, I will have to depend on all of the great forum members for some much needed direction.[:)]
Work is for people who don't hunt
GNC,
Since you didn't do any of the newbie no-no's, I'm led to believe that your frustration lies within the timetable of the smoke. IMO, 8 hours for approximately 30 pounds of meat is too little. Plus, it's 30 pounds of <b> whole </b> meat.
If Kummok loads up his smoker with 30 pounds of salmon strips using 8 racks, the surface area available to absorb the heat is much higher than your experience. Think of it as this: If you dump an 8# bag of ice on your driveway and place an 8# block of ice beside it, which is going to melt first?
The Bradley is designed to cook "low & slow", but it has to meet a middle ground somewhere to suit everybody's needs. The power you required for your timetable could decimate Kummok's salmon in 15 minutes if he didn't keep constant watch.
I've re-read this a couple of times & please don't come away with the feeling that I'm "talking down" to you. That is certainly not my intent, it's just the best way I can figure to express my message.[:)]
We all like helping each other learn and after you've been here a while, you'll realize NONE of us qualify for the title of "expert".[8D]
Kirk
http://www.chezbubba.com
Ya think next time I check into a hotel & they ask "Smoking or Non?" they would mind?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">We all like helping each other learn and after you've been here a while, you'll realize NONE of us qualify for the title of "expert".<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
IMO there are a lot of experts here.
And no, I didn't take it as a talking down, and the ice analogy makes sense. With only two smokes under my belt, I now look back and seen that I went from a light smoke on my first one to a large one on my second, from one extreme to another.
I really appreciate all the positive feedback from everyone. I'll just have to learn as I go; which is good for me and my family as that is more opportunities to SMOKE.[:D]
Work is for people who don't hunt
My source for poultry meat temperatures has been Alton Brown of Good Eats. The poultry temperature I attribute to Mr. Brown, but he of course, must speak for himself. The others are my own doing. I measure all cook temps with a Maverick thermometer.
My cook temps, for many years now are:
Beef: 135
Pork: 145
Poultry: 160
I'm happy to report hundreds of diners served: all are alive and well.
Ken Florian
I smoked some pork loin ribs this weekend. For normal use (just me and my wife), just smoking a couple of sides, this is normally done in about 8-10 hours. This weekend, with dinner for 6 planned for sunday evening, a need some leftovers, and a standing order from a co-worker for whenever I smoke to keep him in mind... well that added up to 29 lbs. of ribs plus one lb. bacon. This all went in on 9:30 pm Saturday night and they were finished between 3:30 -4:30 pm Sunday, for a total of 18-19 hours. I left the temperature a bit lower than I would have liked overnight (I didn't want any suprises come the morning water change-over), but I never had a problem obtaining and holding 200 degrees after that.
The moral of the story: "low and slow" in a Bradley is really not a suggestion, it's pretty much mandatory. Especially if you fill the cabinet to max capacity with meat. Plan accordingly and don't be afraid to estimate that a full cabinet might take as much as twice as long as it would normally take for a typical meal you might plan for 2-4 people.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by kflorian</i>
<br />My source for poultry meat temperatures has been Alton Brown of Good Eats. The poultry temperature I attribute to Mr. Brown, but he of course, must speak for himself. The others are my own doing. I measure all cook temps with a Maverick thermometer.
My cook temps, for many years now are:
Beef: 135
Pork: 145
Poultry: 160
I'm happy to report hundreds of diners served: all are alive and well.
Ken Florian
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Shouldn't be any health issues with those temps, but you're right on the border of safe, especially with the pork temp. As long as you use an accurate and calibrated thermometer you're fine. If I wans't sure of my temp probe I might add on a few degrees just to make sure . . .
John
Newton MA
That pork temp might work for some cuts, but I don't see it working on a pork steak. That cut is too dark.
Olds
(http://www.susanminor.org/Rayeimages/gif/Launch47.gif)