More Hot Smoked Bacon Questions

[Mystic Smoke]

I'm planning to smoke my 1st homemade bacon in the next few weeks but still have some questions.

1. Many of the recipes found on the internet DO NOT call for any nitrate product in their cures. Most are just salt/sugar and some maple syrup. I have noticed that all hot smoked bacon recipes on the Bradley Forums call for a nitrate product in their cures.

a. Is this generally the consensus (using a nitrate) with Bradley Forum members?
b. Is there a big difference in flavors (nitrates vs no nitrates)
c. How dangerous is it, if you are bringing your temp up to 150 F in both cases anyway?
d. Can I just add the recommended amounts (per lb) of Prague #1 to those recipes that don't have any nitrates?

2. Some recipes say to drain the liquid off each day (using the dry cures/rubs) and some say to leave the liquid in, but turn the bacon every day. What happens if you leave the liquid in the bag? Is there any difference?

3. Hab Smoker stated in one post that he either takes his final temp up to 137 or 152 F. What is the significance of the 2 temps?

Sorry to repeat some of the questions, but many of the answers were not clear to me, and I wanted a post with answers to all of my questions.

Thanks guys/gals

[Habanero Smoker]

Hi Mystic Smoke

Welcome to the forum.


1. Many of the recipes found on the internet DO NOT call for any nitrate product in their cures. Most are just salt/sugar and some maple syrup. I have noticed that all hot smoked bacon recipes on the Bradley Forums call for a nitrate product in their cures.
You can just use salt as the main curing agent when making bacon. I believe there are some recipes on the forum that call for only using salt as the curing agent.

There is a big difference between nitrates and nitrites. Nitrates do not provide any protection until they are broken down into nitrites. This chemical change mainly depends on certain types of bacteria being present on the meat. If initially there are few of the needed bacteria the curing process takes longer, therefore nitrates are generally only use when you have long curing times, such as when you make dry cured sausages or meats. The recipes you see on this forum use either Cure #1 which is sodium nitrite, or Morton's Tender Quick which contains both sodium nitrite and sodium nitrate. The nitrites in Morton's TQ start to provide immediate protection.

a. Is this generally the consensus (using a nitrate) with Bradley Forum members?
That would be nitrites (sodium nitrite). I believe the good majority uses cure #1 which is sodium nitrite.

b. Is there a big difference in flavors (nitrates vs no nitrates)
Nitrites give meat that tradition ham like flavor, curing with just salt doesn't. If you want to check out the difference prior to just curing with salt, go to you supermarket. In the bacon section most of the major chains carry "uncure" bacon, which is bacon cured using salt.


c. How dangerous is it, if you are bringing your temp up to 150 F in both cases anyway?
Curing either way, you can safely smoke it at low temperature and bring it up to 150°F.


d. Can I just add the recommended amounts (per lb) of Prague #1 to those recipes that don't have any nitrates?
Prague Powder #1 is the same as Instacure #1 or Cure #1. It is sodium nitrite. Use a 1/4 teaspoon per pound of bacon you plan to cure. Make sure you blend your Prague Powder completely with the other ingredients. You can also reduce the salt the recipe calls for, by the same amount of Prague Powder you added. Also using Prague Powder #1 should reduce you curing time down to 5 - 7 days.


2. Some recipes say to drain the liquid off each day (using the dry cures/rubs) and some say to leave the liquid in, but turn the bacon every day. What happens if you leave the liquid in the bag? Is there any difference?
Leaving the liquid in the bag is very important, because it contain a lot of the sodium nitrites (or salt concentration) which are needed to continue to cure the bacon. It is also important to keep that liquid in close contact with the meat. Never drain off the liquid. If a specific recipe calls for that, I would have to see it to determine why they would call for that.


3. Hab Smoker stated in one post that he either takes his final temp up to 137 or 152 F. What is the significance of the 2 temps?
Taking it to 152°F it is fully cooked, and it is easier to fry up in the morning. Taking it to 137°F keeps the bacon raw, but the 137°F is recommended as a safety precaution to destroy any trichinae parasites that may be in the meat. Most commercial pork is free of this parasite, but it is a precaution. You don't have to bring it to 137°F, but by chance the parasite is in the bacon, you risk cross contamination each time you handle the meat. That is why it is safer to bring it up to 137°F


Sorry to repeat some of the questions, but many of the answers were not clear to me, and I wanted a post with answers to all of my questions.
Ask away. There are plenty of members that will provide help. When I first started I had a ton of questions.

[Mystic Smoke]

Dear Hab Smoker:

Don't know if you get paid for this, but you should, as your constant presence in this forum (and probably many others I have not yet stumbled upon) surely justifies it. Thank you so much for your treatise on my questions. Yes, I did erroneously state nitrates (heck, nitrates/nitrites), and I should know a bit, since I was a biology major way back 30 years ago at UCB. Your post answers all of my questions succinctly. This sure beats what I was smoking at UCB 30 years ago...and it certainly wasn't from the animal kingdom!

Thank you,

Kurtis

[Habanero Smoker]

Thirty years ago I can't recall much either, but I do recall back then I did inhale. 8)

[whitetailfan]

Hi Hab, good to see you're still hanging out giving top advise.

Everything Hab said was right on.
The only thing that I question or am uncertain about is the old Prague#1 and it's many names.
Last time I bought actual prague, it was about an ounce per 25 lbs of meat.  That could be 1/4 Tsp, but I don't have calculations handy.

If you are doing small batches I strongly recommend you find a nice commercially made consumer sized product.
Morton for example is in lots of supermarkets.  The best stuff I ever had I got from Mallardwacker and it was a 1 lb bag from Butcher and Packer.
What I use lately is the Buckboard Bacon (even on bellies not the recommended butts) from Hi-Mtn because I can readily get it here in Canada without any hassle from my sporting goods guy.

I always use a nitrite cure BTW

[Mystic Smoke]

Thanks for your input Whitetailfan.

I bought a bag of Prague #1 (InstaCure) on Amazon. Its enough to cure all swine in the US and the flu they brought along! On the bag it states to use 2 tablespoon (or 6 teaspoons) for 25 lbs of meat. I figure I can always err on the light side, since I will be bringing my internal temp up to 150 F anyway. In the meantime, I wll be looking for Mortons Cure the next time I'm in market, as that may be the easiest and safest.

[Habanero Smoker]

WTF,

You are right. I now use the Basic Dry Cure mix that I no longer measure out cure #1 separately.
If it says 1 ounce per 25 pounds, then that coincides with  Mystic Smoke's post. One ounce of Cure #1 is 2 tablespoons.

Mystic Smoke;

Since you have Prague Powder #1, you can save a bunch of money and make the Basic Dry Cure

[Mystic Smoke]

HabSmoker:

So lets say I come across a bacon recipe (a no nitrite recipe) that is the following:

2 oz Sugar
2 oz Kosher salt
1/4 c Maple syrup

So how much of the homemade Basic Cure should I use? Do I substitute it for the 2 oz Kosher salt alone and continue with the additional sugar that the recipe calls for?

ps. When I saw WTF...I had to think a bit. You meant WhiteTailFan, not what I thought... ;)

[Habanero Smoker]

WTF;

I did some calculations after I finished at least one full cup of coffee, and 1 ounce (2 tablespoons; 6 teaspoons) works out to about 1/4 teaspoon per pound. If you us that volume for the full 25 pounds you will be about 6.25 teaspoons; a 1/4 teaspoon over. Though it is a small amount over, I guess it is always better to weigh.

Mystic;
The Basic Cure recipe/formula comes from Charcuterie, by Ruhlman and Polcyn, and I've been using it for 2.5 years. I now use 1 tablespoon per pound even if the meat is over 4 pounds. Mixing up the full batch is less then buying a two pound bag of TQ.

If you use the Basic Cure, use 1 tablespoon per pound, and eliminate the salt that is called for in the recipe. Keep in mind that by weight each tablespoon is about 30% sugar, so you may want to reduce the amount of sugar that the recipe calls for. When I add maple syrup when curing bacon; 1/4 c is what I add to a 5 - 7 pound slab.

When I and other members of the board started using his initials I had the same thought cross my mind. Now that I've used it so often I forget what other may draw from those initials. :)