Looking to buy a smoker and would like some advice

[FLBentRider]

At 175F it is definitely cooked to doneness, even if you hit a fat pocket (which will be ~10F higher).

Tenderness on the other hand... is somewhat subjective.

Ask and you will get several target IT's for a pork butt, all of them right.

I never stop experimenting... I've pulled them as low as 180F and as high as 210F.

And the "pigs fault" variable is there too. I've taken them to 200F and had one butt that had tough spots, especially in the "white meat" section, while the other one from the same package was perfect.

[Caneyscud]

The pork shoulder (butt) can be but is not necessarily the most tender cut of meats.  It will have to go through the low-n-slow magic.  That collagen still has to break down/melt and the fat has to (at least partially) melt out to produce that succulent, tender goodness you are aiming for.   Low-n-slow is cooking at a temp of somewhere between say 200 and 250.  Some stay on the high end and some stay on the low end although I don't want to wait that extra time.  I usually shoot at 225.  Particularly on the butt, keeping an exact temperature is not all that important - you can have a big swing (say 20 - 30 deg) without detrimental effects - as long as you are generally in the 200 to 250 range.  If you can stay in the 225 range, a butt will generally take 1 1/2 hour per pound- plus/minus.  In the Bradley, it quite often takes longer as the the average temp can often be less for a variety of reasons - no preheat, putting cold meat in, peeking, cutting the smoke generator off when the smoke part of the cook is complete, ambient temperature, weather.....  Without looking at the recipe, the 4 hours was just for the actually smoking time.  It still needed to be cooked (without smoke in this case) until the desired IT was reached.  Most on this forum, will only smoke for a portion of the cook, say 2 hours to 6 hours on a butt.  I prefer a heavy smoke on a but for various reasons, so I generally go even longer.  Sometime during the cook you will hit the plateau.  I generally hit it anywhere between 145 to 165 IT.  The plateau is a good thing!  It's your friend and you should hope it stays around as long as it can.  While it is with you, great things are happening to your meat.  When you first put meat in your smoker, it gradually, but steadily increases in temperature.  But something else happens at about 140 deg.  At that point the collagen (the tough stuff) starts to breakdown and the fat starts to melt (render).  That is a good thing - a really good thing!  But it doesn't magically do that good stuff instantly when the IT reaches 140 - it takes a while and depends on amount of collage, amount of fat, and how much moisture is within the meat.  Ideally, for pull apart meat, you want most of the collagen broken down.  So the longer the plateau, the more collagen is broken down, the tenderer your meat.  But you don't want all of the fat to melt until you reached your planned "done" temperature - keeps the meat moist.  Why the plateau?  The plateauing is caused by a phase change; the collagen and fat in the meat are changing phase from a solid to a liquid. You must supply heat to accomplish this phase change. While the fat and collagen are absorbing the energy (heat) from the smoker to melt, none is available to raise the temperature of the meat.  It is similar to ice melting. When ice and water are in a glass, the water will remain at 32F (0C) until all the ice is melted, then the temperature will increase. The heat goes into melting the ice, not raising the temperature of the water.  You can decrease the amount of time of the plateau by increasing the CT, but you run the risk of adding enough heat that the fat and collagen cannot use any more and it throws off the extra to the meat.  The meat then gets done (gets to your target temperature) before all the collagen is changed and you have tough meat.

[KyNola]

FLBR,
If I'm reading Dood correctly, it was in the Bradley for only about 5 hours.  Dood, am I right on this?  Assuming I'm right, the 4 hours was just the smoking process time.  After that, it still needed several hours to go to get to at least 175 IT minimum.  What temp were you smoking/cooking at?

KyNola

[dood56]

FLBR,
If I'm reading Dood correctly, it was in the Bradley for only about 5 hours.  Dood, am I right on this?  Assuming I'm right, the 4 hours was just the smoking process time.  After that, it still needed several hours to go to get to at least 175 IT minimum.  What temp were you smoking/cooking at?

KyNola

That is correct. I had it in the OBS for 5 hours. IT was 175 when I pulled it out. I kept it between 200-210F for smoking.

[JT-MO]

Only 5 hours? That must of been a very small butt (4lb or under?)
The first butt I did was around 8lb or so and it took about 11 to 12 hours or so. The second one I did was like a 10lb and it took about 24 hours cause I also did a 9lb brisket with it at the same time.

I did what most recommends here, 4 hours of smoke, the rest was cooking, at 220F temp, until around 180F IT.

[dood56]

It was an 8 lb butt. I went off of what the Maverick told me.

[KyNola]

Dood,
Don't get me wrong buddy.  It's not that I don't believe you.  I believe you.  I'm just amazed that you got an 8 pound butt to 175 pounds in 5 hours at 200-210 degrees.  I've never come close to that.  At the least, a single 8 pound butt would take me at least 12 hours.

KyNola

[dood56]

Dood,
Don't get me wrong buddy.  It's not that I don't believe you.  I believe you.  I'm just amazed that you got an 8 pound butt to 175 pounds in 5 hours at 200-210 degrees.  I've never come close to that.  At the least, a single 8 pound butt would take me at least 12 hours.

KyNola

That is the cause for my concern. I am wondering what I did wrong. Could I have had the Maverick misplaced?

[hal4uk]

Dood, How far in did you push the probe?  You should try to get the tip near the center, but not touching the bone.

[dood56]

My butt had no bone. I bought a pork butt and it had no bone. Now the pork shoulder that was available had a bone, but everyone said to get  a butt and that was what I bought. Did I get the wrong cut?

[dood56]

Did my ribs tonight and momma loved them. She said I need to cut back off the cayenne a bit, but great flavor. Smoked them for 3 hours and then went to FTC for 2 hours. Didn't fall off the bone, but plenty tender. Thanks to all for the help!





Now we just have to figure out what we want to smoke when I return from a business trip. We are thinking a brisket will be up next.

[Quarlow]

drooling drooling drooling. man that looks scrumptious.

[anderson5420]

Trump me if I am wrong, but a pork shoulder and a Boston butt are the same thing. You can buy it bone-in or boneless. Cut and paste from Cook's Thesaurus:

Pork Shoulder Cuts




   pork shoulder = pork shoulder butt = pork blade shoulder    Meat from this section is relatively fatty, which makes for juicy, tender, and flavorful roasts as well as clogged arteries. 


Cuts:

pork blade steak = = blade pork steak = pork 7-rib cut = pork steak  Notes:  These are cut from the Boston butt, and they're a cheap and flavorful alternative to pork chops.  They're a bit too tough to fry, but they're wonderful if slowly braised.  Substitutes:  pork arm steak OR pork loin chop
   
Boston butt = Boston roast = pork butt roast = pork shoulder Boston butt = Boston-style shoulder = Boston shoulder = Boston-style butt = fresh pork butt   Notes:  This economical, rectangular roast is the cut of choice for pulled pork barbecue, since it's marbled with enough fat to keep the meat moist while cooking.  You can buy it bone-in or boneless.   Substitutes:   pork picnic roast (also works for pulled pork) OR pork center cut loin roast (This is lower in fat, so roast it at a lower temperature and avoid overcooking it.)

My butt had no bone. I bought a pork butt and it had no bone. Now the pork shoulder that was available had a bone, but everyone said to get  a butt and that was what I bought. Did I get the wrong cut?

[FLBentRider]

IMHO - I think he hit a fat pocket for that temp reading. That would explain the time and temps.

I always stick multiple places - usually about 3 sticks and one of them will be 10-12F higher than the rest. I always go with the low readings.

[KyNola]

Dood,
Those ribs look great.  Reading your rib post I have to ask the same question again.  Did you have those ribs in your Bradley for a total of 3 hours and then FTC?  If so, your Maverick has to be way off on your temp readings.  Ribs being done in 3 hours and a butt at 175 IT after 5 hours tells me the temp in the tower is much higher than what your Maverick is telling you.

Please don't think I'm being critical.  I promise I'm not.  I'm just trying to figure out what's going on.  The good part is momma loved the food.  That's all that matters! ;)

KyNola