Dry Salmon

JZ · May 16, 2010, 09:15:15 AM

I am new to this forum and have had the original Bradley for about 3 years. I only smoked one thing in it (turkey wings) when we first got it and haven't used it since. Been real busy with retiring from work, moving out into the country and building our retirement home.

I finally got time to relax a bit and started reading this forum and noted the praise for Kummok's smoked salmon recipe and decided I would give it try. It was AWESOME. Thank you Kummok for sharing your recipe.

I made some minor changes to the brine since I did not have the exact ingredients he listed. I used yellow sugar instead of brown and only a small bottle of Teryaki since I did not have a quart of the stuff. I also only let the fish glaze for about 2 hours.

I made a second batch yesterday doing the same things I did the first time but to my surprise the salmon came out quite dry. The first batch was really moist and I would like to figure out what caused this batch to be dry. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

The only thing that was different this time was that the salmon I chose from the freezer was a bright red and I think the one I used last time was a mottled white and red one. Also the temperatures in the smoker were slightly different (I had my wife watch the smoker while I was doing some yardwork and she had a hard time reading the gauge. So the fish was smoked at around 90 deg for 2 hrs then 110 deg for 2.5 hrs then 160 for 1 hr.

So could the dryness be caused by the different temperatures or could it be the different salmon that was used?

classicrockgriller · May 16, 2010, 09:33:22 AM

JZ, I don't smoke Salmon, But did want to tell you Welcome to the Forum

and am glad you now will have some time to enjoy your smoker!

Kummok · May 16, 2010, 04:43:09 PM

Salmon! A great choice for "re-entry" JZ!! There's a few things that can cause salmon to be dry.......

1st & Foremost is the type of salmon. Reds (Sockeye)/Kings (Chinook) are the most moist (oily) with Silvers (Coho), Dog (Chum), and Humpy (Pink) being less moist. The "moistiest of the moist" is King belly, my personal favorite, and drips with oil....also takes 2-3 times as long to smoke but 'King Bacon' is definitely worth the wait!

Next in the moisture control search would probably be the drying or as I call it, "pellicle forming" stage. Too long here can dry the meat out beyond smoking's ability to repair. :o

The time spent smoking, especially at the higher temps, can certainly dry out the meat. Anymore, for my own "I like it moist/oily" tastes, my smoking time rarely exceeds 4 hours with 3.5 hours being more routine, ESPECIALLY with the drier types of salmon mentioned above. Yours was in for 5.5 hours and if it was Atlantic, that's a heckuva long time.

Vent control is also a factor to consider....full open allows too much moisture to escape while full closed just steams your salmon (might as well bake it in the oven for a few hours....bleeechk, cottonmouth fer sure!)

I suppose something could be said about the effect of brine on dryness but I've never personally experienced any relationship between the type of brine/time in brine and dryness of the meat.

Given this and what you've said in your post, I'm inclined to suspect your recent experience is related to the type of fish you smoked and the 5.5 hours in the smoker. The "type of salmon" suspicion stymies me a bit though as a dark red, to me, means a Red salmon and they share the top of the "moist list" with Kings. If you're talking Atlantic farmed salmon, all bets are off as the "farmers" can make that stuff any color they want.

The really great thing about smoking salmon though, is that even the "mistakes" are tasty!!

JZ · May 27, 2010, 07:25:10 PM

I was away camping for a week and a half and just got back.

I'm glad to see you responded Kummok and appreciate your input as you have obviously smoked a lot of salmon and your recipe is awesome.

My wife and I love to fish for salmon but only like to eat it after she has canned it or sometimes she makes candied salmon on a dehydrater and that turns out really nice. We go fishing once a year off the west coast of Vancouver Island for 3 to 4 weeks and catch a lot of kings and silvers. Halibut too since we love to eat them deep fried and in fish tacos.

The fish I used for smoking is the stuff that was in our fish freezer from last years catch. One was a red king (guessing it was just under 30 lbs by the size of the fillets) and 1/2 of a silver. The reason I mentioned the red king and mottled king is that some of the guides where we fish prize the white kings (Fraser River fish) for smoking as they say those kings are much more oily than the reds and turn out better on a smoker. The first one I smoked was white and red mixed and the second one was red.

The constants for both batches were the brine, pellicle time and vent opening (about 1/2 to 3/4). The only changes were the color of the fish, the temperatures and the time.

I suspect you are right about the problem stemming from the length of time the fish was in the smoker. I smoked it longer because during the initial 2 stages the temp never got up to the listed temperature so I thought I better leave it a bit longer. Next time I will try a shorter time.

When you say you smoke yours for 3.5 to 4 hrs is that time in the smoker at the listed temps or is that the time smoke is being produced or both?

In any case I am really glad I tried your recipe as I now have another way to enjoy the fish we catch.

Your right about the mistakes tasting great as I took about 5 lbs of the last batch (mistake) on our camping trip and it was a real hit.

I also agree with you about the salmon bellies they are by far the moistest part of the fish. I haven't tried the salmon bacon yet but might give it a try.

I also want to try salmon jerky when I get some time.

The wife is going to clean out the fish freezer tomorrow and can a bunch more. Yummmmmy.

Tenpoint5 · May 27, 2010, 07:57:31 PM

Welcome back JZ!! We have to get you to use that smoker for more than just fish!!

Kummok · May 27, 2010, 10:21:51 PM

Guilty here ,10.5!! ;) ;) (But one of these days I'll expand my horizons....just haven't found anything I like more than salmon that can distract me long enough to smoke it..... :-\ )

Funny thing about the whites, JZ.....used to be that they were culled up here by folks that thought there was something wrong with them, now they are a prized feature on fine restaurant menus?!?!?

I'm one of those wierdos that likes smoke so much that I pump it out the whole 3.5 - 4 hours that the salmon is in the smoker.....if you do try smoking up some salmon bacon, you're going to want to dry it longer and smoke it longer.....some bellies from the 30lb + range can take up to 8-10 hours if you make the pieces too big. Try small strips (skinned) first and you'll have better luck to start.

(Also see that you like halibut in your fish tacos.....which method of meat preparation do you prefer? I've had it prepared as ceviche'd, fried, boiled, grilled, and baked but have pretty much settled on using it beer battered/deep fried for tacos nowadays......)

Tenpoint5 · May 28, 2010, 06:46:31 AM

Kummok have you tried some of the PICO de Gallo sauce I posted on your fish tacos yet? Sprinkle shredded cheese then the pico makes a killer taco in my book.

Just in case someone asks:

Pico de Gallo

2 Jalapenos, sliced and diced 1 Lime, squeezed
4 Large red tomatoes, sliced and diced Olive Oil, 2-3 tblspns
¼ Onion, diced Spice to taste
Cilantro, Put leaves in cup and chop with scissors Minced Garlic

Mix all together and let set before serving. Great with Chips, Meat, Bread, Rice, Pasta........

ADD IN'S: Some different ingredients to give a little different taste when added
Sour Cream, Avocado, Black beans, Mango, Sugar or Honey

JZ · May 28, 2010, 08:52:38 AM

I guess I'm a weirdo too, as I smoked the fish for the whole time (5 hrs the first ime and 5.5 the second) and did not find it too smokey.

The way we do the tacos is to cut the Hali into small strips then coat them in a spice / flour mixture (sometimes we use prepackaged shake and bake coating) then fry them in oil. We use beer batter for the deep fried fish when we have a fish and chip night.

The sauce we use is a mixture of chipolte and ranch dressing and I love it. The whole idea was presented to us on one of our annual fishing trips by the 2 guys camped next to us. When they first offered me a fish taco I thought YUUUCK. But then said what the h-ll. How bad could it be. Boy am I glad I tried them. Everyone we have ever introduced them to love them, even my son in law who hates everything except steak and potatoes.

BuyLowSellHigh · May 28, 2010, 09:01:01 AM

Hard to go wrong on about any version of fish taco's so long as you don't overdo the fish when you cook it. Fried is good, blackened is good, smoked is good. shredded cabbage lightly dressed is a great topping, Pico de Gallo (a near staple down here) is good. If you want to liven up your Pico de Gallo add a small splash of a good Tequila to it - brings a whole new flavor into the mix.

Kummok · May 28, 2010, 06:13:41 PM

MmmmMmmmMmmm, this is getting to be deserving of its own thread! I've copied all three suggestions down wand won't rest 'til I try them all...SEVERAL times! ThanX for recipe/tips, 10.5, JZ, BLSH!!

JZ · June 04, 2010, 03:16:00 PM

Well I smoked some more salmon.

The first batch was a double that consisted of white King, red King and one Silver. The outside temp was about 50 deg. I preheated the smoker but as soon as I put the fish in the temp dropped right off. I had the smoker temp turned up as high as it would go and here are the temp reading that were achieved. After 1 hour it reached 100 deg. after 3 hours it reached 140 deg and after 4 hours it was 150. When I took the fish out the stuff at the rear bottom was way overdone (burned) and I threw some of it out. The stuff at the top was was barely cooked and the fish in the middle was just about right.

Where I had some white fish on the same rack as the red, the white was way more moist than the red. From now on I am only going to want to keep white Kings instead of red ones when I go fishing. I also think that I will only do a double batch again if the outside temps are higher, as the cooler temps seem to be too much for the smoker when there is that much fish in it.

I then did a single batch (4 racks) on the same day. No problem achieving the right temperatures for the right time lines and the fish was more evenly cooked on all of the racks.

So between my wife canning 72 pints of salmon and me smoking 3 batches we have finally emptied our fish freezer of last years salmon. Still got some halibut that I might try smoking. But now we are prepared to restock when we go fishing next month.