4th of July 2010 Princeton NJ Smoke

[njfoodies]

Well, the weekend is coming, and I am going to start late Friday night, or at the crack of down on Saturday morning to fire up the smoker.

I plan on doing a brisket, as well as a corned beef brisket, and have been doing a lot of research on the fourm as to how to prepare them.  I have to say, that after reading the "rueben sammies" thread, I think I will go that route, and do both the brisket and corned beef brisket in Jan's rub.  I think I will do the rub on Thursday night on both, and refridgerate until they go into the smoker, unless anyone recommends otherwise.

The corned beef brisket will be for the pastrami, and the brisket will be for whatever.  May end up slicing and serving with Zelda's world famous BBQ sauce that I absolutely love!  I guess I just have to see if she wants to make some this weekend!  =)

I am assuming that the corned beef brisket will cook a little faster as if I remember correctly it was smaller.  I'll try to take Snelly's advice, cook to an internal temp of 150, and then "FTC" it.  I'll also try the hickory, and go 2-3 hours.

For the regular non corned beef brisket, I am kind of at a loss because I have read so much on here.  Was thinking about substituting light brown sugar in the rub for the regular sugar, but kind of unsure.  Maybe I will do 1/2 and 1/2.  This will take longer to cook I'm sure, and it sounds like I should take it to an IT of 185 or 190 then "FTC."  Now I have to make the decision if I should throw it straight on the rack, in a pan, wrap in foil, etc, etc.  UGH!  So many decisions for a first timer!  LOL!  I think I am going to go the naked route though for my first attempt, and see what kind of bark I get.  I will probably also give it some more smoke once the corned beef brisket comes out.

So, my real question is, what temp should I use for these?  They are obviously 2 different meats that will cook differently, so am I making a bad choice by doing them together?  Would 220 be good for both meats?

So that is basically where I am, so feel free to give me any pointers that might be helpful.  Thanks all for the advice, and thanks for all of your great posts!  I am really looking forward to giving this a whirl, and hopefully they turn out good!  Might also do a turkey roast or turkey breast for my wife since she isn't a beef eater.  Cheers!

[KyNola]

Your temp choice looks good for both.  I wouldn't worry about doing them both at the same time.  No reason why you can't.

Good luck with it, have fun and keep us posted.

[SnellySmokesEm]

NJ - A few things to take note of....  Some of the guys on here might suggest taking the corned beef to a higher temp, say around  170 - 180 so the pastrami is more tender.  The reason I only take mine to 150 (more moist, but not as tender) is because I have a meat slicer that can slice the meat pretty thin.  Also I prefer to wrap the pastrami tight in plastic once its done cooking and has had time to FTC and sit in the fridge for at least a day (I prefer 2 if I have the time) before you slice.  This allows all the smoke and rub flavors to redistribute through the meat.  It also allows the saltiness to calm down a bit.  Some of the guys soak the precooked corned beef for a few hours before before they rub it to get some of the saltiness out, but its a preference thing.  I personally like salt so I don't soak.  I liked the hickory flavor but I am not so sure I would use it again on the pastrami.  Remember its on of the stronger woods.  I would recommend Alder, cherry, or apple.

I usually smoke/cook at 220 or 225.  And as for Jan's Rub: stick the the recipe, its a winner!!!

As for the brisket... ha ha  ;D ;D ;D  you sound like me when I cooked my first brisket.  I was pretty overwhelmed  ::)  My advice to you from one newbie to another:  keep it simple.  I would rub and slather with CYM (cheap yellow mustard) and mop throughout the cook.  A lot of the guys one here have braised and had great success with it, but I did not but I think it was a combination of a few things that turned my brisket dry....   I would use a stronger wood on the brisket like hickory or mesquite. Here a few links on my brisket smokes:
This first one is from my first brisket smoke which I considered a success
http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=14242.msg169622#msg169622
This is my braised brisket that turned out dry
http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=15145.0

Try to take notes!  Good luck, have fun.  And remember there are a lot of great people on here with a lot of experience who want to help, so if you have a question just ask!!!

[njfoodies]

Thanks for the info on the 170-180 for the pastrami.  I will definitely go that route!  Have wanted a meat slicer for years, but have no room to store one in the kitchen as cabinet and counter space is limited, and God knows we have too many cooking gadgets that we use on a regular basis.  The plastic wrap for a day or 2 is no problem at all, and sounds well worth the wait.  I don't think that the soak is necessary for me.  As for Jan's rub, I'll try it as is the first go around, and it does sound like a winner!

Thanks for the brisket ling, and I will definitely read up on it some more!  Thanks a million, and I will report back during and after the whole smoke!  Cheers!

[SnellySmokesEm]

No problem, anytime NJ.  Oh and take pics, we loves us some food porn....

[Habanero Smoker]

You have a good plan, but what you are making is smoked corned beef. Which is good, and generally rubens are made with corned beef, not pastrami. What makes pastrami different form corned beef, is that once the beef is cured it is highly seasoned; generally using black peppercorns and coriander as the base ingredients. I generally take my pastrami to 160° - 165F°, and hand slice it thin across the grain. I find going higher the meat dries too much.

Also most pastrami are not smoked, but smoking gives it an added dimension. This weekend I served some of my homemade pastrami to some friends, and they devoured it. I had to admit, it was one of my best batches, I'm sure the brisket had something to do with it also.

[BuyLowSellHigh]

On your basic brisket, as you have figured out, you have a lot of options.  Rule number one - don't over think it, and keep it simple.

Whether to go "nekked", foil, pan, boat. etc. is largely a matter of preference.  That said, I believe that the quality of meat should be a factor in your decision as well.  If it is USDA Select, then I would encourage using foil, pan, closed pan with some liquid, or boating, to finish.  If it is USDA Choice or better, then naked is a fine way to go.  If this is your first whole brisket cook I would suggest smoking and initial cooking in the Bradley and then an oven finish for easier control at the end (it will also be a bit faster).  I like 4 hours of smoke @ 225°F, then leave it in the Bradley to ~ 165 °F measured in center of the thickest part of the flat section, then either foil or closed pan (foil over a disposable aluminum roasting pan, no added liquid) and finish in 250 F oven to an IT of 185 °F.  Pull it from the oven, keep it closed (no peaking), and FTC for at least 1 hour and preferably 2.  Carryover should carry the IT to 190-195 °F.  If you have both the brisket and the corned beef in the cabinet at the same time just keep the cormed beef above the brisket and keep both in the upper half of the cabinet.

On your rub either brown or white granulated sugar is fine - it won't make that much difference.  Use what moves you.  I would suggest that you hold off on the rub until 6-12 hours before you start the smoke, then wrap tightly in plastic wrap and refrigerate until ~ 2 hours before starting the smoke.  A couple of hours at room temp will help minimize the temp drop in the Bradley when you throw in a big hunk of cold meat.  Preheat the Bradley to 250 °F if you can get it there.

CRG always reminds folks that you can't hurt it - it's already dead.  It's a good thought to keep in mind for your first brisket.  And remember rule number 1 above.  Above all else, enjoy the experience!

[Up In Smoke]

njfoodies,
just for fun here is another twist on pastrami.
just remember to be patient with whatever you decide (cold beer will definitely help  :D)
http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=13848.0;topicseen.

[GusRobin]

I don't know how big your brisket is but you may want to consider the timing. I have cooked a 13 lb brisket and a 6 pound pastrami at the same time at 230F. The brisket took about 23-34 hours. The pastrami about 6-7 hrs. I started the brisket about 6pm and did an overnight cook. I waited until aboutt 7:30am the next morning before putting in the pastrami. Otherwise the pastrami would have been done in the middle of the night sometime. That was my experience.

[njfoodies]

All great info all, and I appreciate it.  Thankfully I still have a few days to get schooled.  Someone sent me a PM saying that an important factor I left out was the weight, so the corned beef brisket is just 3.75 pounds, and the brisket is 6.97 pounds.

I will definitely take pics, and thanks again for helping a new Bradley owner out.  It is very appreciated!  We may be great chefs, but smoking is a whole new animal to us!  Cheers!

[BuyLowSellHigh]

A couple of final suggestions.  One keep good notes, then when you're done and have enjoyed the fruits of your labor add comments on what you would do differently and want to try next time.  It's a learning thing.  Second, if you haven't already I would encourage to read Caneyscud's excellent "pontification" on the matter of Low-and-Slow, within which there are many great insights into the fine points of a brisket.  But in looking through the fine points don't loose sight of his overall and main message.  Here's a link to his post:
http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=16652.msg201923#msg201923

[njfoodies]

I am wondering if I should start the brisket on Friday night.  Hmm.  As for the corned beef, it really doesn't matter when i start that as it isn't going to get eaten the same day.  It'll be be wrapped, a d put in the fridge for a day or two.  We will see.  Great info again. 

[GusRobin]

My post should have read "23-24" hrs ;not "23-34"

[BuyLowSellHigh]

All great info all, and I appreciate it.  Thankfully I still have a few days to get schooled.  Someone sent me a PM saying that an important factor I left out was the weight, so the corned beef brisket is just 3.75 pounds, and the brisket is 6.97 pounds.

I will definitely take pics, and thanks again for helping a new Bradley owner out.  It is very appreciated!  We may be great chefs, but smoking is a whole new animal to us!  Cheers!

Is the brisket whole, untrimmed in the cryopac?

[njfoodies]

Good question.  I have no idea, but will check it out when I get home tonight.  Going to pull it out of the freezer tomorrow to let it thaw out in the fridge!