Montreal Smoked Meat

[Smokeville]

Sous Vide??

This is a joke, right? Great for all sorts of small stuff but considering the size of a brisket do you really want to wait 72 hours for it to get tender????? (and that's the consensus of a number of recipes I just checked).

Rich

[GusRobin]

Its not like you sit there hungry for 72 hrs. You just start it three days early and forget about it until its time to take it out.

[Habanero Smoker]

A lot also depends on what temperature you want to take it to. If you take it to 130 - 140°F it can be done in 24 to 36 hours. To get it to 160°F, it can take 48. Also cutting the brisket into about 5 pound sections or so, also helps.

Here is a good article, Sous Vide Brisket

[Smokeville]

As I re-read my post, I apologize if it came off as flippant. It just took me by surprise!

Rich

[Smokeville]

I've been wanting to try this recipe for quite awhile now and finally have a chance.  I got a full packer brisket this week, a big chunk went to make slow-cooked beef dip sandwiches and another hunk for some MSM.

It's in the brine right now, which smells great.  Can't wait, I'll post up some pics after smoking and steaming.

Funny, I started defrosting a 12lb packer a few days ago and today it's in the brine. I'll show you mine if you show me yours! I hope to smoke it next Friday or Sunday and steam the day after.....

Rich

[Smokeville]

And here is a question for Habenero Smoker!

The Picard recipe calls for a 7 day wet cure. Other recipes I've seen suggest 6 to 10. What determines the length of the cure? I may need to smoke it after 6 days or wait until 9....

Thanks, Rich

[GusRobin]

As I re-read my post, I apologize if it came off as flippant. It just took me by surprise!

Rich

No problem. Actually until I did my first sous vide, I felt the same way. Now its the only way I make short ribs.

[WoodlawnSmoker]

And here is a question for Habenero Smoker!

The Picard recipe calls for a 7 day wet cure. Other recipes I've seen suggest 6 to 10. What determines the length of the cure? I may need to smoke it after 6 days or wait until 9....

Thanks, Rich

I'm interested in the answer too as I may be smoking mine after 6 days in the brine.  From what I have found, it's the thickness of the cut of meat that really determines how long it needs to stay in the brine.  I've consulted some other recipes using the same concentration of brine for MSM and pastrami, and many of them state that 3-4 days or 3-5 days in brine is adequate.

[Smokeville]

As I re-read my post, I apologize if it came off as flippant. It just took me by surprise!

Rich

No problem. Actually until I did my first sous vide, I felt the same way. Now its the only way I make short ribs.

Well, the first thing I thought of was salmon done that way... and it seemed a long way from brisket.

There is a show we see here in Canada from Australia called My Kitchen Rules and there is no end of trouble for the contestants who try sous vide techniques. Mostly salmon but also the occasional eggs '60'.... That show is actually the #1 rated prime-time show in Australia.

[Habanero Smoker]

And here is a question for Habenero Smoker!

The Picard recipe calls for a 7 day wet cure. Other recipes I've seen suggest 6 to 10. What determines the length of the cure? I may need to smoke it after 6 days or wait until 9....

Thanks, Rich

You always want to brine long enough for the meat to be fully cured; having said that, there could be a variety of reasons for the difference among recipes. Often when you see a wide range of brining times, it often depend on the source the recipe came from, and/or the individual's experience from using that brine. If the levels of sodium nitrite are within safe levels, when it comes to wet brining, the extra time will not increase the amount of sodium nitrite the meat uses, but the extra time may make the meat taste saltier. If you see very long brining times, such as 2 weeks or even 30 days, they tend to be old recipes that used salt peter, and have been converted to use cure #1, but the brine times have not been adjusted to accommodate the faster cure (cure #1). The different recipes that times may vary over several days, you may want to experiment with shorter times for the ones that use longer brine times, but that can get expensive if you are brining brisket. If you find using the longer times, the meat comes out too salty, you can always soak.

The brining times should be based on the amount of salt, the thickness of the meat; (a lot of sources go by the weight of the meat). The cut of meat can come into play; the fattier the meat the more time you want to give it to brine.  Also if you inject; injecting reduces the brine times. I only use 4 - 5 days to brine a brisket flat, if I was brining a full packer I would inject and brine a few more days. I'm not sure what type of Kosher salt Picard is using, but if it is Morton Kosher salt, or one that is similar in volume, he uses the same amount of salt I do to make corned beef, with slightly less cure, and as mentioned I generally cure 4 - 5 days. I can't tell by his photo as to whether he had brined a flat, or point, or whole packer; but looking at his cook time and temperature; I'm thinking it is a flat.

What cut of brisket/beef are you brining? How much salt and volume of water are you using? What temperatures are you planning to smoke at, and finish cooking at?

[Smokeville]

Thanks, Habs.

I've cut the brisket into flat and point and each is in a seperate container. I'm unsure of the weight distribution and my cut was not at all 'professional'. The total weight was 12lbs. I made 2 gallons of brine and put 1 gallon in each. No injection. The salt is a different story because last time I used Mortons which I can buy in the US but this time used Windsor coarse salt which has 480mg of sodium per 1/4 tsp. That's the same as Morton's Kosher except the crystal size is bigger and that may throw off the total salt content.

It sounds like I could take the flat out of the cure in about 4 days (Thursday) and smoke then.

Thanks, Rich

[Habanero Smoker]

If the sodium is the same as Morton's it should be very close to the same measurement per volume.

It wouldn't hurt to keep the flat in the brine one more day. I've never cured a point by itself, but the point may also be done by day 5 or 6. You can hold the flat in the refrigerator until the point is done. Just tightly wrap it in plastic. It is better to refrigerate one day after taking it out of the brine. That time give the salt and cure time to equalize throughout the meat. Then you can smoke both at the same time.

[Smokeville]

Thanks, Habenero Smoker!

I don't doubt that both will come out great.  Pictures to follow.

Rich

[WoodlawnSmoker]

I was able to finish this up today, very pleased.  It was just a "tad" chewy, but I think I didn't steam it long enough, I went with temperature instead of fork doneness.  I'll steam it some more before I slice up the rest.

You can never duplicate real Montreal smoked meat but I think this recipe comes close, very tasty.  We had some Reuben sandwiches with this meat, some of my home made sauerkraut and some smoked cheese, wow.  I'll do this one again, very nice.

[Smokeville]

That looks astonishing!

The last (and first) time I made it I oversteamed and the meat was hard to carve.

Practice makes perfect!

Rich