bologna casing loose, shriveled... 1st attempt at bologna

[toolhawk]

Ok made a batch of bologna for 1st time (made summer sausage for 20 yrs no problems ), followed a recipe with pics from this site to a t , 50-50 pork butt to beef , ground right , emulsified.... made ring bologna in natural and made some in collagen summer sausage style casings , put in smoker a 100 degrees / no smoke for 1 hr. then 120 for 2 hr .........added smoke for 2 hrs at 140 degrees then put in hot water to rise to 156 , heres were the problem started  , noticed a abnormal amount  of liquid inside of both casings during bath , finished them out , cold bath , let  hang and large summer sausage style has lots of loose casing , natural casing are minimal but you can see wrinkles  , product inside ring natural is very firm and great tasting , will try other tonight, what causes the casing to do that , to hot of water or to fast of a rise in temp or ? really watched water temp so don't think that was it, to much fat in grinding ? Thanks for any suggestions , again , awesome flavor and texture as the guys at work devoured it.   

[tskeeter]

Toolhawk, just some clarification.  The casings that weren't natural.  Were they collagen?  Or were they the fibrous casings usually used for summer sausage?  In my experience, collagen casings don't do very well when soaked in water, so I'm wondering if it the type of casing you used is a factor in your loose casing.

How hot was your hot water bath?  Based on your description of liquid inside both types of casing that you used, I'm wondering if your water bath was hot enough that you melted some of the fat in your bologna.  When  you cut the ring bologna in the natural casing, did you find a thin ring of congealed fat on the outside of the sausage?  That would indicate the sausage got too hot and the fat melted, then congealed when you put the sausage in the cold water bath. 

[cobra6223]

I do my  fibrous summer sausage casings in hot water all the time and never noted any water in the casing. I have gotten the water to hot and have had fat outs but you should notice fat in the water and the casings feel greasy when you  take them out of the cold water. What was the temp of the hot water?

[toolhawk]

Sorry , fibrous and natural for the ring , I'm sure it was the fat inside the casing  was the liquid , really tried to watch water temperature(170)  aging the product , yeast , texture is awesome , but the visual of the larger fibrous has a bit to be desired , I am going to do another test run but no water bath this time , every thing else will be the same, I will just let Bradley smoker do the heating.

[renoman]

I had loose fibrous casing once and I believe it was because I did not soak them long enough. I think they expanded in the water bath.

[mustangmoe]

If you took your hot water bath to 170 F degrees (you do not want to go over 160F) you most definitely fatted out you sausage. Maybe not that much but yes you started to melt the fat and that caused your wrinkling. Pikeman_95 has some good info on hot water baths Also Sailor posted on another forum about the process. I will copy and past it here just as a reference.

" For full disclosure, this is not my idea and I learned of the Turkey Roaster idea on another forum.  The first one to bring the hot water bath to my attention was Kirby and he posts on another forum.  When he and his buddies make sausage they are making 60 pounds or more at a time.   Kirby has a large stainless steel tub that he made that is heated by propane heaters that he puts the tub over.  He has water circulation pumps pulling water off the bottom and shooting over the top to keep the water at a constant temp.  He will smoke a load of summer sausage or hot dogs or sausage or what ever road kill he has made up and smoke with heavy smoke for a few hours.  After the smoke he pulls them and puts them on racks and lowers them into his tub to finish off.  While the hot water bath is going he puts another load in his smoker and repeats the process.  He can put up a lot of smoked sausage in a short amount of time.

After Kirby started posting about his hot water bath a few other guys on that forum started doing the hot water bath using a Turkey Roaster.  I don't know who came up with the idea and if I remember I will be sure to edit this to give them credit.

Why a hot water bath instead of just finishing them off in the smoker you ask.  Well, several things.  First it cuts the time by at least one half.  Second, the sausage turns out plump and juicy.  Third, you can do several loads in a day instead of just one. 

Why does doing the hot water bath speed up the process?  Heck, I don't know the scientific reason but I would hazard a guess that water is a great conductor of heat verses air.  For some reason, meat that is put in hot water say at 160 degrees will get to an IT of 152 a lot faster than meat that is in 160 degree air.  You can have hot and cold spots in your smoker and that too will tend to keep the meat from coming to IT.  Water will cover all surfaces of the meat and be consistent which helps drive the IT up.

It is just like having your house temp at 78 degrees and having a tub of water at room temp, the tub water will feel cooler to the touch than just sticking your finger in the air.  When you finish a long smoke in the smoker it is suggested that you plunge the sausage in a cold water bath to take the temp down to around 100 degrees to stop the sausage from cooking and then to let it bloom at room temp for a few hours.  I don't use any ice in my cold-water bath as I just fill a tub with cold water from the faucet and it is pretty much at room temp.  When I pull sausage from the smoker with an IT of around 152 they go into the cold-water bath and they loose the heat pretty fast.  They loose it faster then if you just lay them out or hang them at room temp and let the air-cool them down.  So the process for cooling is the same as for heating if you get my drift.

If you decide to do a hot water bath please very carful not to let the water temp get above 165 degrees or you will fat the sausage out.  Also remember that probes are not waterproof and you will short a probe out if you get the lead in the water.  Don't ask how I know this.  You can use a food grade sealant to seal where the lead goes into the probe and this should take care of a potential problem.

I don't use the hot water bath on all of my sausage as I am kinda old school and like to finish my summer sausage in the smoker then do the cold water bath and then bloom and fridge them.  When I am making Kielbasa or smoking other sausage that have been stuffed in hog casings I like to do the hot water bath as I have found that the casings don't dry out or become tough.   If I am using collagen casings I don't hot water bath them as I have had them get loose and peel.  I have had good success with using cellulose casings with the hot water bath and after blooming them and in the fridge over night the casings peel right off and I have a great skinless dog or skinless sausage.

I will mention that if you do use the hot water bath and if you see what looks like water between the casing and the meat DO NOT poke a hole in the casing to drain out the "water".  It ain't water!!!!!! It is fat that has rendered and it is under pressure.  I can tell you that poking a hole in a casing to let the water out will shoot a stream of hot grease across the room and if properly aimed it can coat the kitchen ceiling.  Don't be concerned about the "water" pockets if you get them.  Just let the sausage cool down and fridge over night and the fat will get solid and you can peel the casing and wash it with warm water and all is good.  Or you can just throw on the grill and all is well.  Them little fat pockets between the casing and the meat never hurt anyone.  You generally get them when you stuff and get a fat lump next to the casing and as the meat sets up the fat doesn't have anywhere to go.

I hope this has some been of some help to those that are willing to try a hot water bath or perhaps never heard of the hot water bath. 

[toolhawk]

THANKS!! doing a small test run right now and found my Bradley digital smoker temp is not reading correct , shows 139 but only 100 , put 2 separate digital temp readers in there and they both are ready the same, will with them throughout this run things should be much different,  again thanks, trying to post pic.

[toolhawk]

Today's test run

[manfromplaid]

why is there no water bowl

[toolhawk]

 Much happier with using a more controlled water bath [/img]

[cobra6223]

that does look mighty good an yes keeping the temp under control is the key to the water bath.