Attempting TX BBQ in PA

[smoke1001]

Hello everyone. I'm new to the forum and new to Bradley Smokers. I live in Pennsylvania. For Christmas 2008 my wife gave me a 4-rack Bradley digital. Bad weather and timing kept me from using it until this past Mother's Day weekend in April. On Saturday afternoon I started my attempt at Texas barbecue.

I took the 14.2 pound packer cut brisket from the fridge where it had wet aged for 2 weeks, and let it rest on the counter for 2 hours. The meat had nice supple white fat, and bent easily in the middle. I didn't need to trim. I left the 1/4 to 1/3 inch fat cap in place.

While it rested I started the 1 hour break-in of the smoker at a temp of 150 using hickory, and also put together 3/4 cup of rub using this recipe:
2    Tbl chili powder
2    Tbl sea salt
4    tsp mustard powder
4    tsp onion powder
3    tsp basil
3    tsp black pepper
2    tsp Adobo powder
2    tsp garlic powder
2    tsp ginger powder
2    tsp red pepper powder
1    tsp celery seed
1    tsp cumin powder
1/4  tsp cinnamon powder

After the brisket rested an hour, I rubbed 1/2 cup of the rub into the surface and crevices of the meat. At the end of the second hour of the rest I generously coated the meat with French's mustard. I could still see the meat and spice rub through the mustard glaze.

Initially the smoker Temp Setting was set to 280 and the Oven Meat Temp showed 220. The feeder tube was stacked with hickory bisquettes and the Smoker Timer set to 8 hours. The vent cover was set at 5/8 open. I replaced the stock water pan and bowl with a deep rectangular aluminum cake pan, and filled it 2/3 full with 2 liters of boiling water. I placed the brisket on the top rack, and had to buckle it a bit on the point end to fit it in. There was still more than an inch clearance at the top of the oven.

Over the next eight hours I adjusted the Temp Setting every half hour or so to keep the Oven Meat Temp in the 220 to 230 range.

At the end of the 8 hour smoke period, now around midnight, I opened the oven and refilled the pan with boiling water, adjusted the vent cover to 5/8 closed, shut the oven and went to bed.

Five hours later I saw the Oven Meat Temp had dropped to 219, so I adjusted the Temp Setting one last time. For the remainder of the cooking time the Oven Meat Temp stayed between 220 and 225.

I pulled the brisket out of the smoker at 8:45 am after a total cooking time of 17.75 hours, and a total smoking time of 8 hours. I wrapped the brisket in aluminum foil, then in a heavy cotton table cloth, and put it in an Igloo cooler where it rested for over 4 hours until about 1 pm.

The meat smelled wonderful, real smokey and spicy. It had a great texture: held it's shape enough to cut slices with a sharp non-serrated knife, but easily fell apart. I could cut across the grain with a fork.  It felt moist but without being greasy.

The bark was a bit on the strong side, but not objectionable, just slightly salty and flavor intensive from the rub. It wasn't, however, very smokey tasting. A very, very slight smoke flavor was there, but not what I expected after 8 hours under a thick hickory fog.

Just 1/2 inch under the bark, and the smoke flavor was gone completely. The meat was beefy, and tender, and juicy, and unctuous ... but not anywhere close to Texas barbecue. Except for the bark, I could have gotten the same result from a much shorter braise in a large electric roasting pan.

Sad to say, the only way to salvage the day was to resort to Cattlemen's Barbecue Sauce. Everyone enjoyed the brisket, and compliments ranged all the way up to 'best I ever had'. But what I wanted to serve was Texas barbecue with sauce on the side, or no sauce at all. I wanted that smokey taste that you normally associate with hand crafted bacon or, here in Pennsylvania, hickory smoked Lebanon bologna. I wanted the meat to be the star, the one-man show, not the lesser part of a duet.

Just to be clear, I never probed the brisket to determine the internal temperature, but relied on the scale of (roughly) 1.25 hours cooking time per pound. That part worked perfectly, I have no complaint about the texture or the juiciness.

Also, I only cracked open the oven one time, a bit after the 8-hours of smoke were completed. I never basted, never spritzed, never soaked.

The process was easy enough, to a degree, and yielded a wonderfully moist and flavorful tender cut of beef. But it wasn't Texas barbecue. And without the sauce, it really didn't taste like barbecue at all.

What did I do wrong?

Thanks, Smoke1001

[NePaSmoKer]

It sounds like your on the right track except for the 8 hours of smoke. I would have gone with 3-4 hours, boated and foiled the briskit and kept the heat at 225* I would invest in a polder meat probe to keep an eye on the IT of the meat, well worth the $20.

BTW if your calender for June 20th is open feel free to attend the NEPA smokeout. http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=9275.0

nepas

[smoke1001]

NePas,

I have a meat thermo, but there was no need for it, the meat was perfectly cooked. Like I said, it was tender and juicy and beefy. The problem was, no smokey barbecue flavor.

So how would less smoking time (3 to 4 hours instead of eight) yield a smokier tasting brisket?

Confused in SE PA, Smoke1001.

[Habanero Smoker]

Smoker1001

Welcome to the forum.

I have to agree with NePas, four hours of smoke is all that I use. The eight hours of smoke may have contributed to the strong bark flavor. Smoke will only penetrate until the surface of the meat reaches 140°F. After that you will not get any further penetration, but if you keep applying smoke it will adhere to the surface. If you got smoke penetration down  into the meat 1/2" that's great. Generally smoke will not penetrate more the 3/8" to 1/4".

[pensrock]

I'm from Pa as well as NEPAS, welcome to the forum. I have not ever had 'real' Texas BBQ so I do not know how to compare. But like NEPAS said we normally only smoke for 3-5 hours. Maybe you need to use Mesquite, I know thats the favorite wood for people from Texas. Hopefully WTS or others from Texas will chime in with their opinions. I have been having a terrible time finding a brisket in central PA, I have been wanting to do another for a couple months now. The one I did last fall only got 3-4 hours of hickory and the smoke flavor was great. I also put the meat in the center of the tower, not at the top and normally keep the vent 3/4 open the whole time. It sounds like you have everything pretty well worked out, maybe using messy wood will give you the taste you are looking for? One other thing I do is rub the brisket the night before and let it sit in the fridge overnight, not sure if it matters but it always comes out great.
pens

[westexasmoker]

I agree with whats already be stated...3-4 hours worth of smoke, vent 3/4 to full open, and definitely go with mesquite!  ;D

C

[Caneyscud]

Pretty much ditto on the answers.  The one thing I would have done differently would be not have put the mustard on. Mustard is used to keep the rub on and I'm not much on using a rub on brisket.  I've used 6 hours of mesquite with good result - but to my taste, could have used more - my favorite Texas BBQ is pretty smoky. If you are comparing to the Prime Central Texas joints many of them only sprinkle some salt, pepper, cayenne and possibly some garlic on - many don't use a rub.  And many use Post Oak or Live Oak for smoking.  And some use a high temp cooking technique.  As already said, the smoke flavor doesn't penetrate the meat much, the smoke flavor comes from the bark and the fat.  Salt intensifies the smokiness.  A few months ago, I had a conversation with a pitmaster in Lower Mississippi that learned the trade in one of the Prime Central Texas Joints that I frequent when flying in and out of Austin.  He used Live Oak on the 12 briskets he delivered to me and just salt and pepper.  I think he used the high temperature technique.  An interesting statement he made was that he never used foil, he just put them in a cooler when he took them off the fire.  He said, in his opinion the foil somehow took the smoky flavor out of the meat.  Don't know if that is true or not, but I did recently have a brisket from a Nashville BBQ joint.  Before slicing my slices, it was wrapped in foil and under a heat lamp.  Although it had bark, there was almost no smoke flavor.  I typically don't use foil when smoking - I mop, so can't compare.  Everybody has their favorite way to smoke something, you will just have to experiment until you find the technique that results in what you are looking for. 

BTW - welcome to the forum.  You did your homework well.  This is a fun place where smoking addicts can be safe!

[westexasmoker]

Good catch Caney, I missed that.  I never use mustard on beef, pork is one thing, but beef just say no!

C

[FLBentRider]

I don't use mustard on anything.

[Wildcat]

I don't use mustard on anything.

Nor do I.  Oops, I forgot, I do use mustard on hot dogs while resting in the bun, on cornbeef and rye sandwiches, and on brats after the cook.  ;D

[smoke1001]

Thanks to all who responded, sounds like some ideas to ponder: no mustard, no mustard, no mustard, open the vent 3/4, put it on the middle rack, use mesquite, use oak, use a salt and pepper rub, apply the rub the night before, don't use a rub, foil while cooking, no foil while cooking, Texas crutch, no Texas crutch, low temp for maximum smoke penetration, high temp technique for maximum smoke penetration, smoke for 3 to 5 hours, smoke for 6 hours, smoke for more than 6 hours... I'll definitely be keeping my butcher happy for the next few years as I try all the permutations of all the suggestions. I thought there was some major problem, some critical step that I missed that caused an otherwise juicy and fall-apart-tender 14 pound brisket to have virtually no smoke flavor after eight hours of sitting in hickory heaven. Guess not. Seems like the bottom line is, it's an art and not a science, and nobody actually knows why I got what I got. Or it could be the mustard. ;) I'll try some of the suggestions and let you know - maybe on the next one I'll try cold smoking for the first three hours. Anyway, I appreciate all your help, and thanks again. --Smoke1001

[Caneyscud]

1001,
It just means there is no ONE RIGHT way to do almost anything smoked.  Best advice is to take what you did and make a change or two each time you smoke until you get what you want.  Kinda like lots of things in life!

A few years ago I did a simple and not too complicated of an experiment.  Took 4 prime rib steaks.  One rather fatty, one I cut the fat off, one was fatty, but salt rubbed on it, and the last was fatty but with sugar.  Cooked them all next to one another on the same grill.  The winner in taste was the salted one - by far.  Seems that salt either helps the meat absorb smoke or intensifies the taste of the smoke.

Meat protein starts to set or cook at 120 degrees F and is completely cooked at 140 degrees. Once the protein sets it can not and will not absorb any more smoke flavor. Especially the leaner meats. This is important to know and learn.  Smoke resins may deposit on the meat or bark, but the meat will not absorb any more smoke flavor.

Knowing that you want to get your meat in the smoker as cool as possible - contrary to most recipes. The cooler the meat the better, but not frozen. The cooler the meat the larger the range of temperature you have to develop your smoke flavoring. Putting your meat in the smoker at 40 deg rather than 80 deg, gives you 40 more degrees for your meat to absorb more smoke.

Knowing that the meat protein sets at 120 degrees F, it is not necessary to use a lot of wood to achieve a great smoke flavor. Hence many usually only use wood for the first two to four hours of smoking.  It is said that excessive wood can lead to a harsh flavor on the outside of your meat.  I don't necessarily subscribe to that theory if the "right" smoke is used.  The right smoke is "thin and blue".  More people tend to get in trouble with smoke especially in smaller smoker chambers where the air space to meat ratio is smaller. The problem with harsh smoke flavors usually is a result of improper combustion.  Every time I see a recipe that has you soaking wood chips, I cringe.  The soak usually produces more smoke, but it is a "dirty" smoke - lots of soot, creosote, and other nasties.  A few hours in that can produce a creosoty taste.  Using green wood or wood with lots of bark can do the same.  Also letting the wood or charcoal catch fire in the fire chamber can also lead to "dirty" smoke while the wood and charcoal are starting to combust.  The best way to add heat to a fire chamber is to have a separate fire pit and shovel in already glowing red coals.  In the larger trailer smokers, where you have much more air space to meat density, the amount and time of wood burning can be greatly increased.

The "bark" as it is known in the BBQ world is the outer crust developed by the rub which you use.  It absorbs the juices as it cooks and adheres to the meat and I believe, continues to absorb smoke the entire cook.  To me it is important to have quite a bit of salt in your rub, and no sugar, especially with beef.  It is important to remember not to "MOP" your smoking product too soon, since this will wash away your dry rub and you will not develop the bark. My rule of thumb is to not mop for the first two hours, allowing my dry rub to develop the bark before I will even start to mop my products.

Dry rubs can be applied the night before or the hour before, this is really determined by the amount of salt ratio in your rub. The greater the salt ratio the more moisture it will pull out of your meat product. I like to apply my dry rubs on the product while the smoker fire and chamber is getting hot or to temperature.

[Wildcat]

 :D  I can understand your frustration.  Lots of different information out there and I am sure it all works great - just depends on each individuals taste preferences and what they individually consider the "ideal".

I am rather a simpleton when it comes to brisket and prefer a more natural meat taste.  I try to select one with a nice fat cap and good marbling.  I coat with olive oil to hold the salt and pepper (sometimes I add garlic and onion powder) then smoke for 4 hours with either messy wood, hickory, oak, pecan, or even apple.  I then continue to cook until desired doneness.  The entire time I try to maintain around a 210 cabinet temp.

I always rely on my PID and Maverick probes to make certain of my cabinet temps because the ones that are built into the Bradley's are inaccurate (if for no other reason because of their location) at least until the meat temp is high.

By the way, I have yet to have a bad experience with brisket.  Had one turn out just a little dry once, because of it being extra lean with very little fat cap, but was still very eatable.

[smoke1001]

Sorry for the delay in answering, connection problems.

CaneyScud, good details in your response. Makes perfect sense. Cold smoked products have always, to me, tasted smokier than hot smoked ones.

Wildcat, you also speak the truth, my truth anyway: when I grill burgers or steaks, I'm usually doing that with just basic spices: salt, pepper, on rare occasions some onion powder. I like that minimalistic approach, and probably for my tastes should have stuck to that with the brisket. Might not have altered the smokiness, but then maybe it could have. Maybe the sugar came into play there, as CaneyScud's prime rib steak experiment seems to indicate.

Although a totally different meat type, I tried several racks of baby backs this past weekend using those two guidelines: smoke it cold, spice it simply. It wasn't a fourteen pound hunk of boneless beef, but I think I see I'm on the right track with the results.

I took the ribs from the fridge, removed the plastic packer wrap and rubbed generously with salt and pepper. Cut each rack in two, and into the smoker with just the generator on for two hours of hickory. The cabinet temp never got above 85. For the final hour of smoke I turned on the oven and kept the cabinet temp around 220. Then three more smokeless hours at 220. Finally, for the last three hours, I splashed a tablespoon of Coke (no juice on hand, apple or otherwise) over each half rack and shrouded them in foil and back in the smokeless smoker, again at 220. It was a total of seven hours cooking time.

Outstanding. Just the way I like ribs, smokey and tender. The racks just kept their shape when picked up, but a slight twist of a bone made it come clean from the meat with nothing adhering to it. Homemade dipping sauce on the side. I'm a happy man.

Thanks to all who responded, especially to CaneyScud and Wildcat. For me, for my tastes, their advice made all the difference. In June I'll try that same technique with a brisket.

Thanks again!

On antother topic, I notice that some use bricks during hot smoking for the increased thermal mass. Could the same sort of thing be done using frozen bricks when cold smoking? Has anyone done this?

[Caneyscud]

Frozen bricks - now that's using you noggin!  Gotta ponder on that a while.  Don't know why it wouldn't be beneficial to maintaining cooler temps in cold smokes.  Common sense would say that stacking them in a mass rather than a single layer would make for a slower acting heat sink.  I could see a system where 8 are frozen - 4 are put in until you see a temp. raise, then those are replaced by the other 4 and the original 4 are put back in the freezer for refreezing - or something like that!

BTW - the USDA would probably cringe at the 2 hours at 85 CT.  But I never tell them, and I'm still alive.  Besides you are cooking to above 160 anyways.