Lefty_Smoker our own Knock-Off Artist.... Bubba Pucks

[Oldman]

Lefty_Smoker,

It just came to my attention via this linK: http://cgi.ebay.com/BRADLEY-SMOKER-BISQUETTE-SAVER-Bubba-PUCKS-3-pack_W0QQitemZ290248795950QQihZ019QQcategoryZ10035QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

that there is another source for metal pucks that are a knock-off of the original Bubba pucks. What I find interesting concerning this matter are the two quotes below from you:

Yes, Chez Bubba recently closed up shop to spend time doing other things.  If you're looking for bubba pucks, check ebay, that's where I got mine.

so I went to ebay for my pucks.  I can't imagine there being much if any differance between the pucks.  The ones I got from ebay came with eased (filed) edges so they slide nice and easy through the smoke generator puck mechanism.  Do the BubbaPucks come the same way?  I'm happy with my ebay pucks, and according to the seller's 100% positive feedback rating, I guess many others are as well.   

You must have thought that we all fell off of the turnip truck when we were children and such we are stupid. You pretended by your above quotes that your are a customer of the vendor of whom you puchased these pucks from. Yet in fact you are the supplier of this item!

I don't think anyone here cares that you sell these type of pucks. However, I'm sure that many of us including myself take direct offense to you calling them Bubba pucks. See image below I just took this pix of your offering:



From the original posting I find that your pucks for 3 are $2.91 cheaper than the authorized Bubba Puck supplier. I have to ask myself just what have you brought to the table  here on the forums that could possible justify any member doing business with you over that of Yard & Pool Company. Especially for a item that cost less than $3.00 difference. I just did a search on the recipe site and you have not even offered up one recipe.

On the other hand Bryan (Yard & Pool) has brought much to our table. In fact he is supplying the item for our current contest.

When I was growing up Mother told me that you can always tell a leopard by its spots and if it slithers it is more than likely a snake. 

Until you remove the referance to Bubba Pucks I will remind everyone on every thread you start or reply to, that I see, just how you conduct business what your business model is really like.

Olds

[HCT]

Here, here Olds. Good one. ;)

[car54]

Thanks Olds for keeping us aware of these rip offs.

Brad

[Smokin Soon]

I have said it before, It's worth a couple of bucks to be able to pick up the phone and talk to your supplier, get some advice or inquire about a product. All my stuff came from Y&P. BDS, a ton of bisquettes, Bubba pucks, ET-73, Vac bags, jerkey screens the works. I have been buying from EBAY for 10 years now and have never had a seller that was happy to pick up the phone and talk to you.

No ranting here, just my 2 cents worth.

[Lefty_Smoker]

Oldman, you sure have a wild imagination.

I purchased my Bradley Smoker and shortly thereafter, Chez Bubba closed shop.  It was then posted on the forums that BubbaPucks@gmail would shortly thereafter start selling the pucks.  I tried several times contacting Bubbapucks@gmail but they never responded.  I even posted as much in the forums here that I was trying to email them but they weren't responding.  Go look for yourself, it's all archived in the forums.  I even emailed them the message headers so they could investigate.  Guess what, they still never emailed me back.   I then went on ebay where there were other puck suppliers at the time and ordered a set of pucks from Ultra-Ind.  Once I received my pucks (from Ulta-Ind) I realized that there was nothing to them and that due to some connections I had I could make these things if I wanted to.  Kummok at the time, stated in the forums that he and Chez no longer had any financial/business ties to Bubba Pucks other than an advisory role.

Here are a couple quotes from Kummok....

"I no longer have any financial or business ties, (other than just minor advisory), to Bubba Pucks, but I suspect that you will see the first and original Bubba Puck become very competitive with the copy cat in the near future, which should prove beneficial to the end users."

"At 57, I know that things change, and I'm sure that the "Bubba Puck market" focus will change now that the inevitable copycat has entered the ring....may the best puck win and may the Bradley smoker/buyer be the ultimate winner....smoke on!"

Let me repeat that if you didn't quite catch it.  Kummok himself, the inventor of the original Bubba Pucks said, and I quote "may the best puck win...."  Does that sound like somebody who was vehemently opposed to other people selling pucks?  It certainly didn't to me, so I felt it was OK to start selling pucks myself seeing as though the guy that came up with the idea was pulling his hat from the ring.

So it was then that I did in fact start making them and selling them on ebay.  At first I never even mentioned the word Bubba in my auctions, but then later added it to the auction title only just for search purposes.  But in my description it clearly states that my pucks are only "similar to Bubba Pucks but less expensive".   I never claimed they were original bubba pucks, and still don't.

You guys can call me a knock-off artist, copycat, or di@kweed for all I care.  The truth is that there is nothing magical about Bubba Pucks or any version there of, its simply a piece of aluminum the same size as the wood pucks.  Not exactly top-secret proprietary IP stuff, that y'all make it out to be, ya know. 

Oh, and I didn't know creating/sharing new recipes was a requirement for staying in good standing here on the Bradley forums.  I guess I just figured my general advice and helping when I could was enough to be welcome here, but I see now that wasn't the case.  In light of these new site requirements, perhaps a warning should be posted atop of the home page so all the new members will know that they have to share recipes in order to be a contributor in good standing here. 

Anyway thanks for bring attention to my auction, I sold more pucks today all thanks to you Oldman!  LOL

later, 

[Bubbapucks]

Ok first off I am the son in law and I was the one who lefty emailed at [email protected] and I had just taken it over and was having some issues and I even let you know that and again I will apologize for that not replying to you in a timely manner. 
My concern is you use the Bubba Puck name to get people to find your product, as you said in your post "but then later added it to the auction title only just for search purposes" which means to me that you want people to associate your product with ours and you will sell it cheaper than we will.  I asked nicely for you to just stop using the name and all I get from you is some rude response about how low you will take the pricing down and you do not care since you work for a steel company.  I do not care that you copied the idea that is your choice just stop using the name. 

If anybody has any questions or concerns please let me know at [email protected]

[Lefty_Smoker]

Rude response?!? 

now that's funny, I was trying to help!!!

[Kummok]

Kummok here..... Wasn't planning on entering this thread, but I've kinda been sucked in by being quoted by you, LS. Although used a bit out of context, I stand by those quotes....the "winner" in a competition of product manufacturers should certainly be the end user, in this case, Bradley Smoker users. I don't hear anyone contesting that. Nor do I hear anyone trying to make a simple solution, Bubba Pucks, out to be rocket science or "top-secret proprietary IP stuff".

LS, you can provide a product to Bradley users at a cheaper price "til the cows come home" and I will still cheer you on...that's the American way of business and  I haven't heard anyone complain about that on any Forum threads. Although I personally find unimaginative thinkers to be rather boorish, I do support the idea of businesses competing to provide the customer with the same quality product for less money.

What I do call into question herein, is your honesty in your response posted here and on the thread at " http://forum.bradleysmoker.com/index.php?topic=5371.0" from which you have quoted me. You have stated on this thread that you were not selling pucks until after the dates of your posts on that thread. Those dates were June 5, 2007 through May 30, 2008. Yet a quick check of your eBay feedback reveals this: "...Thanks for the pucks   bama8422 ( 71)   Jan-15-07 13:53-- (#290068802710)" and "...10 bucks a puck a bit expensive but I knew and accepted.   leopold.tremblay ( 9 )   Jun-21-07 08:37-- (#290126878220)". To me, that translates to you selling and delivering pucks in Jan&June/07 but not revealing that in your June/07 posts and then trying to cover that up in your posts today by stating,"I even posted as much in the forums here....they still never emailed me back.  I then went on ebay where there were other puck suppliers at the time and ordered a set of pucks from Ultra-Ind.  Once I received my pucks (from Ulta-Ind) I realized that there was nothing to them and that due to some connections I had I could make these things if I wanted to."  To quote Shakespeare, ""Something is rotten in the state of Denmark." I'm not accusing you of anything...yet....but the above findings put your credibility on this Forum into serious question. Having posted these findings, I'll give you the floor to better explain your side..... but I'd highly recommend that you back off calling Olds reputation into question....you're shoveling sand against the tide.....he's too well known by most of us on this forum as a person of exceptional integrity.....you don't have that kind of track record on this Forum yet......

[Habanero Smoker]

Olds;

Thanks for bringing this to our attention. Now things are beginning to piece together, I was wondering why he was blatantly distorting Yard & Pool's prices, while pretending he purchased his pucks from e-Bay.

These days $3.00 won't even buy you a good beer at a restaurant. It is much better to forgo one drink and to purchase from someone who provides customer service.

[Lefty_Smoker]

Kummok, now your letting Oldman get into your head and now your imagination is also running wild, and incorrectly I might add.

Yes, I began selling my knock-off pucks on ebay in June '07, roughly the same time that thread was going on, after getting no response from Bubbapucks@gmail, after buying a set of pucks on Ebay.  Contrary to what you want to believe, I did not sell any saver pucks in January.  Those two auctions in Jan '07 were for two hockey pucks autographed by a Detroit Red Wing player.  I played in a charity hockey game that was put on by one of the former Detroit Red Wings.  At the game, he signed a bunch of pucks, hats, jerseys, pics, etc.. for all the players that played in his charity game.  I offered up a couple autographed pucks on ebay after the game in January .  That was the "pucks" the person was thanking me for in January.  And since I apparently need to now explain all my auctions to you guys, the third auction in late Junuary was for a Tickle Me Elmo toy.  Figured I'd just throw that out there so you guys don't waste any more time trying to speculate even more. 

While doing all of your digging and investigating into all of my auctions and postings, LOL, didn't you ever find it strange that I had no ebay auctions between January and June?!?  Supposedly the time that you are now accusing me of selling my saver pucks while supposedly keeping it all secret here on the forums???  Strange indeed!

If I started selling my saver pucks in January like you believe, they why aren't there any auctions in February, March, April, May, early June, etc....?????  I'll tell you why, BECAUSE I WASN'T SELLING MY SAVER PUCKS THEN, that's why.    You guys really need to take a deep breath and collect yourselves. 

In the hundreds of saver pucks I've sold on Ebay, all with no negative feedback btw, I've only had the word "Bubba" in the auction title all of FOUR whole times.  Yep that's right,  I've sold (4) sets of pucks on ebay with "bubba" in the auction title and you guys all get your panties in a bunch.  Like I said, I've sold hundreds of saver pucks on ebay without using the term BUBBA in my auction title, I only recently added it so my auction come up when you search for the term "Bubba Pucks".  If you guys are that upset, fine, I'll remove the Bubba reference in my auction title, since it made little to no difference anyway. 

I think you guys have been inhaling too much smoke lately!

[begolf25]

Lefty,

I think you are missing the point here. In your post on 5-29-08 while you were selling your pucks on eBay you posted the following statement...

"The cheapest source continues to be the regular ebay offering of a set of (3) pucks for $25.99 plus $6 shipping, for a grand total of $31.99 shipped.   

So who is doing the raping on the price of pucks AND shipping? 

Hint:  it ain't the ebay sellers! "

In the same post you accused our company of raping our customers and overcharging, which you later apologized for. You tried to act like you were helping out forum members by pointing them to ebay for cheaper prices when it was only for the self promotion of your product.

If you are as honest as you state why wouldn't you just come out and tell the folks here you also offer an alternative if anyone is interested? I think you would have found this method would have been met with a much different reaction instead of trying to make another member look bad in hopes to drive people to your product behind the scenes.

I have no problem with competition, in fact I love it. It is what helps keep me motivated everyday to improve our business. I hope this issue will clear itself up very soon.

Bryan

[Oldman]

I'll remove the Bubba reference in my auction title, since it made little to no difference anyway. 

Good!

Now unless you have something to contribute to this community I suggest you just go quietly into the night.  No hard feelings here.

However, if you continue to talk smack then you will find that most members here will stop replying to your threads and / or postings. You simply will be ignored.

You can be a member in good standing with this community or just another Ghost. It is your call as to how you will be  distinguished.

Good luck in your decision,
Olds

[Kummok]

No need to get petty & sarcastic, LS.....I was just calling the question and giving you room to answer. I made it pretty clear that I wasn't "accusing you of anything...yet..." I also made it clear in the response that my concern for Forum users was your credibility on the Forum, given the findings easily available to anyone. I'm a retired peace officer/firefighter and can't help myself, intuitively checking into things a bit further when something just doesn't look right. Limitations of "public access" to eBay archives didn't allow me to drill down enough to discover what the "pucks" were by eBay item #. Lacking further evidence to the contrary, (and your unnecessary sarcasm aside :(), your explanation sounds plausible to me.

This "airing of dirty laundry" could easily have been avoided if you'd responded in a cordial, accommodating manner to the first requests by Y&P, et. al., to stop using a name that your product didn't earn through years of service to the Bradley users. Your promise to stop using the Bubba Puck name and subsequent removal of that name on your eBay site is, I'm sure, valid reason to see this thread die..... I'll watch for that to happen.

As far as the "inhaling too much smoke" is concerned, I can only wish....other project demands have made the distance between me and my Bradleys much wider than I like at the moment :-\.....

[HCT]

Troll :-X