PID or BBQ Guru Raptor and Competitor Pkg.

drano38 · January 16, 2006, 04:07:35 AM

Iceman,
You asked for some pics of the TS controller last week . .
I've never posted pics before, but here it goes.
This is an view of the complete unit:

This is the back showing wires:

Another one of the back:

Hopefully this will help, along w/ the instructions posted earlier in the thread.
Drano

Oldman · January 16, 2006, 07:21:00 AM

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">but I still don't understand how if the slide is all the way to the right and is being over ridden by a thermostat it can effect residual heat from the stock BS cooking element. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> The elememt if all the way to the right when on is much hotter than say at mid-range. Thus it will take it longer to stop heating up the unit.

What is interesting about my TS is it is wired differantly than shown in the photo. It was suppost to be either an 8 and/ or a 16 amp contoller. However the set up for the 16 amp will not work. My controler has the same lay out for #1 and #2 but instead of #8 though #11 I have #7 though #11 with an option of "normally closed" or "normally open".

Olds

manxman · January 16, 2006, 02:43:11 PM

For anyone interested in the method posted by drano38 in the UK, Dwyer have a UK website, the equivalent model appears to be the TS 13020 which retails for about £47 plus VAT and carriage.... say around £55-60.($90)

Not sure whether there are any equivalent units from UK suppliers which would work out cheaper?

www.dwyer-inst.co.uk

Would it be possible to post a picture of the whole thing in situ with the BS Drano, help me get the complete wiring set up clearer in my mind![:I]

Manxman.

nodak · January 16, 2006, 06:40:59 PM

I Understand the TS switch is effected by ambient air temp <14F, so how about ordering their 10 foot thermistor and setting smoker outside your house/garage with the switch inside??? After all, if it's that cold outside I can assure you my smoker isn't going to be any further than that from somewhere warm, Brrrrrrrr.

"If you're not living on the edge, You're taking up way too much room, so get the he-- out of my way."

drano38 · January 16, 2006, 11:09:57 PM

manxman,
Here are some pics:

Keep in mind the TS is simply an on/off switch, that also needs its own electical power to function. So my blue wire goes to the TS to provide it power, and the wire also jumps over to the Switch input and output terminals.
I plug the biscut heater into a wall outlet so it has continuous power.
I plug my blue power cord into the wall outlet, and the heating element cord into the other end of the blue cord. The blue cord gives the TS power, and the TS turns the power on and off for the heating element.
Hopefully the pictures help clear this up.
The other black wire seen coming out the TS is the temperature sensor that I insert into the top vent.
Call the UK Dwyer office and ask for a technical rep. The US office reps were very helpfull.
When I find more time, I will wire the TS into a Radio Shack plastic box and include 2 plugins--one constant on, and one swithced w/ the TS.
Good smoking.

nodak · January 17, 2006, 01:12:42 AM

drano, I checked out their website and see they have dual switches/input. Now could a guy wire these in line and have one going to the meat(not sure what kind of thermo end these come with)and one to smoker, so it would also maintain meat temp once it hits target temp(cutting power to smoker switch??? Haven't had time to work this out on paper to see if possible. Seen TSX when I quickly looked when I was working, not sure if this would be the one to work, but noticed only $6.00 more.

I should of worked this out b4 I mention it, so I don't look like a fool if I figure out I'm shooting my mouth off. If not maybe someone else will have an idea from this. Like to keep it economical if my guru goes back, so I can try this.

Only reason I was looking is I'm still having problems with my guru. They are confident it's accurate and my 3 thermometers are off 10 to 20+F for long intervals of time. Well I had just a little sausage left to smoke and is now 128F. The guru is on ramp set at 110F with the probes rapped together in tinfoil for cooler smoking.

"If you're not living on the edge, You're taking up way too much room, so get the he-- out of my way."

TomG · January 17, 2006, 02:06:25 AM

OK Nodak how is this for whacko? Get two TSs, setup one with a normally open(off)relay to control cabinet temp. Setup the other one in the normally closed(on)mode to control meat temp., so that when it's sensor, being used as a meat thermometer reaches the desired internal temp. it will shut down the whole system until the meat drops below target temp. at which point it will turn the system back on. Of course, that's assuming that the TS sensor can be used as a meat probe.[:o)]

nodak · January 17, 2006, 02:20:46 AM

Bingo Tomg, that's what my original thought was, but that's 2x$49 where the dual type(TSX) I seen was $55.00 plus probes, but as we speak I am looking further into it. I think TSX is cooling only not sure if they make one like I suggest with one switch able to be normally on open and other switch normally on closed on same unit, with two sensors?? Sensor price isn't really an issue as I think I would order a 10ft with the single switch cuz of temp requirement. Did I mention I was tight, even more so when I'm not happy with something that's more expensive.

What kind of equipment box were they talking about mounting this in??? Is this what I call a toolbox?? Does this need air circulation around it??? A

"If you're not living on the edge, You're taking up way too much room, so get the he-- out of my way."

drano38 · January 17, 2006, 03:00:09 AM

Nodak,
Can't say on your idea to run 2 controls--it sounds like a great idea, and should work--meat unit says "On" until meat temp hits target, and then the air unit controls cooker temp.
But if you call the company and ask for tech rep, I bet they could tell you which control would work if any single one would. They should also be able to tell you about a meat probe.
Most of the controls do not come w/ a temp probe, but I believe they were only about $10.

The box I got to mount mine in is a project box from Radio Shack. I got the biggest one so I can also install 2 110 volt plugins, one hot, one switched w/ the TS. I plug the box into the wall, then the biscut/smoker into the hot plugin, and the heating element into the switched plugin. If you want to only mount the TS, one of the smaller ones would work well.
It doesn't apear to generate that much heat, so I'm not going to get too concerned. Manual says it will operate from 14 to 158 degrees F.

Keep us posted
Drano

TomG · January 17, 2006, 03:02:47 AM

Radio Shack calls them project boxes and you can get them in almost any size. Maybe someone who has used a TS, can tell you about how much heat it generates.

TomG · January 17, 2006, 03:10:49 AM

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The elememt if all the way to the right when on is much hotter than say at mid-range. Thus it will take it longer to stop heating up the unit.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Olds, I just saw your posting and I totally agree. But still don't understand why you need a rheostat in a system controlled by a thermostat, unless the heating element is too hot for the application and that has never been a complaint with our BSs. As far as residual heat is concerned, I can't think of any closed heating system where you don't try to decrease temp. swings by maximizing residual heat with insulation and heater element mass(heatsink?).

manxman · January 17, 2006, 09:46:07 AM

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">manxman, Here are some pics:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Many thanks for the pics Drano, very helpful.[:)]

Manxman.

Oldman · January 17, 2006, 03:14:19 PM

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Olds, I just saw your posting and I totally agree. But still don't understand why you need a rheostat in a system <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Simply to control temp. swings.

Set it up anyway you want, but having the element on High will add to the swing.

Olds

bubbagump · January 17, 2006, 11:30:00 PM

Hi TomG,

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">But still don't understand why you need a rheostat in a system controlled by a thermostat, unless the heating element is too hot for the application and that has never been a complaint with our BSs.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
That's like saying why do you need a rheostat on a light that's controlled by a switch? The reason is to control the intensity of the light, just like the rheostat on the BS controls the intensity of the heating element.

The TS is a fairly dumb device. I don't mean this as a critcism, it's just a fact. It just turns on and off based on the setpoint and deadband. It cannot make any adjustments to its output as the temperature nears setpoint. Therefore, when the temperature hits setpoint and the TS shuts the heating element off the residual heat left in the heating element will carry the temperature beyond setpoint. How far beyond depends on the intensity of the heating element and the space in which to absorb it. The higher the intensity of the heat and the smaller the space, the more likely you are to have greater temperature swings. Keep in mind, the BS is a fairly small cabinet.

Since the TS is not a PID using the rheostat will give you the ability to control your BS temperature with a little more precision.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">As far as residual heat is concerned, I can't think of any closed heating system where you don't try to decrease temp. swings by maximizing residual heat with insulation and heater element mass(heatsink?).<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Run that one by me again. Not quite sure what you mean by that.

Bubbagump

Phone Guy · January 18, 2006, 12:32:53 AM

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by bubbagump

The TS is a fairly dumb device. .<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

This is exactly why it will work for me.[;)] I am looking for a simple temp control. I would like to see Bradley incorporate a TS or some other digital temp display on the BS. $50 is the cost to buy one. If Bradley were to by say 5000 at a time the cost would be quite a bit less.